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archangels ghosts and Bigfoot oh my it's

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just another night for Supernatural

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girls real stories real answers to

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life's biggest supernatural mysteries

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and now for another exciting interview

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with Errol experts in this world and

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others here's your host paranormal

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researcher Patricia Baker on the one the

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only

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[Music]

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welcome everyone to another exciting

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episode in 2018 can you believe it we

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are here with the first show of the year

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it's a very exciting show I'm your host

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Patricia Baker I am here with my co-host

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the beautiful Patricia Kirkman pique all

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the way from sunny to sunny what the

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temperature is there I may just die no

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it's okay it's a little cool right now

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yeah it was in it's like 71 72 oh my god

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no sunshine that much sunshine that's

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the same makes a difference my heart

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we've been freezing to death here we

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really have yes yes I know it's gonna

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end though I think after this weekend if

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we all survive this weekend we will go

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on to warmer temperatures

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I hope so watching the ice the fireman

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trying to put out a fire in it's nothing

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but ice yeah air hoses and they're

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dripping okay it feels pretty good here

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today

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it sure does they're in the right place

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that's where you are so we've got a

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great show tonight because we're talking

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about cannabis and spirituality with

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Steven gray we're gonna bring him on a

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little while and we're also gonna be

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talking to Ezra Parsi buck who is a

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marijuana consultant to cannabis

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consultants here in Massachusetts and

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he's gonna help us get some clarity on

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what's going on with these crazy laws so

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we'll bring asthma on in a minute but

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first we gotta check in with you it's a

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new year what's going on for us

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numerological yeah the new year is all

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about partnerships teamwork being

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cognizant of everybody else's feelings

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all of us are going to walk around with

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this oh woe is me kind of a feeling

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because that sensitivity buttons pushed

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on everybody but the personal year or

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the excuse me the universal month this

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year is a three so it's all about good

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communications and creativity and being

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able to go forward and look at all these

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neat things so if we take and tie that

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up with a partnership and by

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partnership is a key throughout the year

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partners coming and partners going so

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you're gonna read about a lot of

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marriages coming up in engagements in

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fact Hilton Paris Hilton got engaged

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today oh my god

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and a yes at a 20 carat ring okay of

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course so the proper hand up but if you

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hate marriages and divorces are going to

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be think because partnerships as I said

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they're coming into going so people will

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be tend to be a little overly sensitive

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which could also make them insensitive

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so if we kind of play really pretty with

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each other and try to make sure

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everybody gets their piece of the pie

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help serve them make life better it'll

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be better for all of us okay so now we

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know what the theme is which is

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communication now we've got a lot of

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really good paranormal stories on our

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Facebook page so be sure to visit us

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there at Supernatural girls with a Z

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give us a like follow us you'll be sure

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to be in touch with all the things that

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we've got coming up as you know DK I got

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an an inside call today from one of my

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peers about the UFO stuff now we're not

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going to talk about it right now but we

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are going to talk about it next week so

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be sure to again keep tuning in to our

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Facebook page go to our website

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supernatural girls comm to sign up for

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our newsletter the fringe files we're

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going to have lots of new information

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coming out also about how to form your

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own spirit team we have got the best

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stuff coming I'm always the best guests

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on our show and of course the best

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audience so we're going to jump right in

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tonight we are just jumping in and we're

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gonna introduce you to as R upon Z buck

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again he is a cannabis consultant here

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in Massachusetts esra welcome to the

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show hi Patricia Ann Patricia thanks for

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having me great to have you here great

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lucky to have you this evening do you

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spell some of this confusion so many of

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us are going through it's a mess no I

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know we were talking off the air PK and

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I and all of you about the fact that it

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has become legal for recreational use in

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it's been legal for medical use now for

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for the third year after legalization it

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was a very very slow rollout and still

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is in fact there's there should be 35

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full open dispensaries one for each

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county and I believe there's only 12

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that have gotten open so it's just been

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a very slow process it seems that way

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and it seems like the regulations are

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very very strict and also that people

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don't know what really is going on with

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the recreational aspect that became

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legal this year so we were hoping that

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enlighten our audience because we've had

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a lot of questions from people and then

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wanting to know when we're going to have

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you back to talk about this very subject

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so if you can enlighten us as best you

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I'll see what I can do so yes the the

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medical loss of medical marijuana passed

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in 2012 a lot more strict you had to be

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a patient you had to get registered by a

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doctor and it was partly why the

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recreational law passed is because the

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rollout was so slow and it was the it

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was rolled out by the Department of

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Public Health which for decades has been

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anti marijuana so they they didn't

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really have much incentive to just make

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it roll out as fast as they could and

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the the code was very stringent now as

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far as recreational they are they've put

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in a time line so that this doesn't

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happen so they are actually moving

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forward a little faster even though we

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passed it you know last year and and so

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when when is it going to happen it's not

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like you January first hit you know two

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days ago and we think okay great we'll

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just go to a shop and buy but the way it

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works is that the regulations will be

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presented by March 1st so that everyone

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knows all the hoops they have to jump

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through in order to open a shop

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open a cafe start their own cultivation

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site start a delivery service there's

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all kinds of possible you know

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businesses that can be created then on

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April 1st they'll be accepting

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applications for these businesses and I

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believe there's five classes of business

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so there's the cafe the cultivation the

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retail the so those are the three main

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ones and then there's sort of different

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subcategories like are you a micro

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business are you gonna be a big business

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are you more ancillary so there's a lot

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of opportunities more investors and

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business people here which is

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interesting but what about just the

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average person I mean they don't know

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what's legal what isn't and as we

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discussed before some people at least in

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Connecticut are being arrested even

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though they shouldn't be getting

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arrested that's right it's a very

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bizarre legal area that's actually gonna

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go forward for possible possible years

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so right now if you're over 21 in the

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state of Massachusetts you can possess

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cannabis up to one ounce actually it

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might be two ounces now if you're a

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medical patient you can possess ten

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ounces you can grow it in your home you

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can grow up to 12 plants per household

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you can give it away to friends and

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actually you can procure it so the idea

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is that you can still purchase it if

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you're an adult but it's illegal to sell

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it so that's a weird gray area but now

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you have yes so you have people who you

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could be a person whose grows your own

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marijuana maybe you make some brownies

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you know you process it you make some

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brownies you're traveling to your

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friend's house for a party and

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everything is completely legal you get

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pulled over by the police if he smells

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that the Pahlavi smells pot brownies and

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he sees that you have 25 brownies he

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could say well that that's those are

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packaged for individual sale or that you

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could sell those and so I'm gonna arrest

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you for intent to sell oh my god that's

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just so counterproductive to what all of

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this is about yeah so I've been

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with lawyers one of the things I do is

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consult with lawyers and and and

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defendants in these cases and it's it is

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very crazy because some of them are just

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truly legitimate patients they have a

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legal amount in their possession

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but either the police and I don't want

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to disparage anybody I think everybody's

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sort of doing the best they can

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occasionally you have police are just

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they're old school they see marijuana

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and they just think it's bad and so they

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try and throw the book at the people

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I've had cases - or a guy caught with

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one joint and they go back to his house

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and search his whole house so education

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needs to happen and also even so when

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they the idea is this year July 1st the

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first shops will open for people over 21

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but even then you could buy cannabis

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from a shop and then be driving down the

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road and if you get pulled over and if

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the cop thinks you intend to sell that

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if you try to make your own money

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selling it you could get arrested and go

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to jail for it because we still have

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laws on the books against selling if you

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don't have a license to sell marijuana

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so it's a it's a very confusing law

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basically the state is trying to create

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a situation where there's so many hoops

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to jump through so that it deters people

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from trying to do an underground

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business and also incentivizes them on

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some level to say all right well we're

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presenting you with the hoops so just

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jump through them and then we won't

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arrest you in there to their credit they

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are also trying to do a few things that

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that many people in the industry are

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worried about one at one is this idea of

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big marijuana so it's these huge

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corporations that have tons of funding

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and they can go in and they send their

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team of lawyers in and they don't have

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any problem jumping through all these

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hoops you know double security systems

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and a camera has to be at every single

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angle in your establishment and you have

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to track your marijuana via video from

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the point it's planted as

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all the way till it arrives with the

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customer so in order to prevent the big

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guys from getting all the money they are

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creating crafts marijuana co-op

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cooperative and micro business

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categories so that you can have a

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smaller business but still you have to

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have dual security teams and you have to

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have you could be in big trouble well I

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wanted to just as well please give

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people your website so they can find you

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if they have questions they can contact

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you directly what is your website it is

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now esra helps calm so you can just

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email me as red as your helps calm you

274
00:12:53,789 --> 00:12:51,669
can find me online I have a tons I have

275
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tons of information for patients if

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people are in that blog post so as or

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helps calm it's the easiest way to find

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me okay we're gonna have you back on

279
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when your book is out esra so thank you

280
00:13:13,879 --> 00:13:05,139
so much for joining us to help clarify

281
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definitely stay warm though let's now

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move to spirituality in cannabis because

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that is really the topic for tonight's

284
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show and this is something that has not

285
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really been addressed except by our

286
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amazing guest tonight Steven gray who

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wrote this book cannabis and

288
00:13:44,759 --> 00:13:36,999
spirituality it is a very rich book and

289
00:13:47,099 --> 00:13:44,769
is well done his many Silicon tributed

290
00:13:49,409 --> 00:13:47,109
to it so let's let me just tell you a

291
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little bit about Steven because he is a

292
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teacher and writer on spiritual subjects

293
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and sacramental medicines he has worked

294
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extensively with Tibetan Buddhism the

295
00:14:05,129 --> 00:14:01,779
Native American church and with Ethio

296
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genic entheogenic medicines he's also

297
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the author of another book returning to

298
00:14:14,189 --> 00:14:11,589
sacred world a spiritual toolkit for the

299
00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:14,199
emerging reality he's also a conference

300
00:14:18,389 --> 00:14:15,850
and workshop organiser leader and

301
00:14:19,240 --> 00:14:18,399
speaker as well as a part-time

302
00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:19,250
photographer what

303
00:14:23,710 --> 00:14:21,770
this guy not too okay well let's get him

304
00:14:26,560 --> 00:14:23,720
on the show Stephanie welcome to

305
00:14:36,940 --> 00:14:26,570
Supernatural girls ah thank you can you

306
00:14:41,110 --> 00:14:36,950
hear me okay we can i unmuted my mic all

307
00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:41,120
by myself yeah so tell us a little bit

308
00:14:45,550 --> 00:14:43,370
about how you got into the spiritual

309
00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:45,560
side of working with cannabis what

310
00:14:52,090 --> 00:14:49,970
attracted you to this topic okay well I

311
00:14:55,540 --> 00:14:52,100
guess they have to go right back to the

312
00:14:57,730 --> 00:14:55,550
late 1960s for that because I'll try to

313
00:15:03,520 --> 00:14:57,740
keep this short it's not my nature to do

314
00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:03,530
that but the the shortest version I can

315
00:15:08,610 --> 00:15:06,530
I can make it is that there was an

316
00:15:11,980 --> 00:15:08,620
explosion of interest in both

317
00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:11,990
spirituality and psychedelics in the

318
00:15:18,250 --> 00:15:15,410
late 1960s in the in North America and

319
00:15:21,520 --> 00:15:18,260
other places and cannabis was sort of

320
00:15:23,010 --> 00:15:21,530
dragged along into that in a way a you

321
00:15:28,090 --> 00:15:23,020
know a whole new generation of people

322
00:15:30,070 --> 00:15:28,100
this baby boom generation demographic is

323
00:15:33,130 --> 00:15:30,080
suddenly out of nowhere more or less

324
00:15:35,260 --> 00:15:33,140
started to smoke cannabis as well and so

325
00:15:36,910 --> 00:15:35,270
I was interested in all of that I was

326
00:15:38,620 --> 00:15:36,920
interested in the spiritual side of it

327
00:15:41,500 --> 00:15:38,630
much of the spirituality was focused

328
00:15:45,750 --> 00:15:41,510
toward Asia such as Buddhism and

329
00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:45,760
Hinduism for example and the the use of

330
00:15:51,329 --> 00:15:49,010
psychedelics LSD being the main one at

331
00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:51,339
that time but certainly not the only one

332
00:15:55,780 --> 00:15:54,050
was associated with that spirituality

333
00:15:58,329 --> 00:15:55,790
for a lot of people certainly not for

334
00:16:00,940 --> 00:15:58,339
everybody but I became very interested

335
00:16:03,160 --> 00:16:00,950
in that and refugees you know began to

336
00:16:05,940 --> 00:16:03,170
see that there was the whole other

337
00:16:08,380 --> 00:16:05,950
dimension to life that far exceeded what

338
00:16:10,930 --> 00:16:08,390
most people had experienced or even

339
00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:10,940
heard about that could be opened up

340
00:16:15,670 --> 00:16:12,170
potentially through the use of

341
00:16:17,500 --> 00:16:15,680
psychedelics and then what happened was

342
00:16:19,570 --> 00:16:17,510
there was a I guess you'd call it a meme

343
00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:19,580
going around in what we called the

344
00:16:24,690 --> 00:16:22,730
counterculture at the time this group of

345
00:16:28,510 --> 00:16:24,700
people now often referred to as hippies

346
00:16:30,860 --> 00:16:28,520
which was okay you from you've had an

347
00:16:32,390 --> 00:16:30,870
opening of some kind or another

348
00:16:35,060 --> 00:16:32,400
now what are you going to do with it you

349
00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:35,070
can't just take LSD for the rest of your

350
00:16:41,170 --> 00:16:37,290
life everyday unless your name is

351
00:16:47,990 --> 00:16:44,269
it didn't necessarily help in that

352
00:16:49,850 --> 00:16:48,000
regard anyway more seriously the the the

353
00:16:52,910 --> 00:16:49,860
idea or the meme that came along at that

354
00:16:54,620 --> 00:16:52,920
time was you need a daily path of some

355
00:16:56,630 --> 00:16:54,630
kind or not her so I got involved with

356
00:16:59,050 --> 00:16:56,640
that for me that became Tibetan Buddhism

357
00:17:01,370 --> 00:16:59,060
that went on for quite a while until

358
00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:01,380
Terence Mckenna do you guys know who

359
00:17:05,780 --> 00:17:03,570
Terence Mckenna is so tell us who

360
00:17:07,670 --> 00:17:05,790
Terence McCullough is okay well he could

361
00:17:10,429 --> 00:17:07,680
have a whole into in a whole you know

362
00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:10,439
hour just to talk about him but he he

363
00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:14,850
was he was the number one philosopher

364
00:17:20,329 --> 00:17:16,890
philosopher spokesperson for

365
00:17:22,340 --> 00:17:20,339
psychedelics starting in about the 1980s

366
00:17:27,860 --> 00:17:22,350
and influenced a lot of people he passed

367
00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:27,870
away I think in 2000 but he still you

368
00:17:35,810 --> 00:17:30,930
can find his YouTube videos all over the

369
00:17:38,090 --> 00:17:35,820
place very interesting guy and he had

370
00:17:40,640 --> 00:17:38,100
gone to South America and discovered

371
00:17:42,830 --> 00:17:40,650
that people had been using substances

372
00:17:45,740 --> 00:17:42,840
like ayahuasca for thousands of years

373
00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:45,750
but always never recreationally or you

374
00:17:49,460 --> 00:17:47,490
know maybe there was the odd rogue you

375
00:17:52,970 --> 00:17:49,470
know but basically they always used them

376
00:17:54,950 --> 00:17:52,980
either ceremonially or for healing

377
00:17:58,910 --> 00:17:54,960
purposes that's what a shaman is a

378
00:18:00,380 --> 00:17:58,920
healer and so he kind of put those two

379
00:18:02,360 --> 00:18:00,390
together for me because the tibetan

380
00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:02,370
buddhist community that I was involved

381
00:18:06,580 --> 00:18:04,410
with didn't have anything to do with

382
00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:06,590
psychedelics and didn't encourage them

383
00:18:11,150 --> 00:18:09,450
so but I was remembered there was this

384
00:18:13,820 --> 00:18:11,160
spiritual potential with those

385
00:18:17,690 --> 00:18:13,830
substances so that's how I got back into

386
00:18:20,210 --> 00:18:17,700
it again and then that led to me

387
00:18:21,650 --> 00:18:20,220
eventually becoming connected to a

388
00:18:23,810 --> 00:18:21,660
conference up here that I've been

389
00:18:27,020 --> 00:18:23,820
co-organized for seven years called the

390
00:18:29,090 --> 00:18:27,030
spirit plant medicine conference and I'm

391
00:18:36,500 --> 00:18:29,100
giving like I said I'm trying to keep it

392
00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:36,510
short but yeah I'm leading up to the

393
00:18:42,980 --> 00:18:39,090
sort of the key moment so to speak the

394
00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:46,399
yes one of the people that we had at the

395
00:18:50,149 --> 00:18:48,690
conference is Kathleen Harrison who's

396
00:18:53,060 --> 00:18:50,159
remarkable person she was actually

397
00:18:54,980 --> 00:18:53,070
married to this Terence Mckenna for 15

398
00:18:58,340 --> 00:18:54,990
years but she's a she's a world-class

399
00:19:00,710 --> 00:18:58,350
ethno botanist teacher and a great elder

400
00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:00,720
spokesperson for the psychedelics and

401
00:19:05,419 --> 00:19:02,250
she and I were having a conversation

402
00:19:07,070 --> 00:19:05,429
because I'm the one still am the one who

403
00:19:09,950 --> 00:19:07,080
often finds the speakers for the

404
00:19:12,680 --> 00:19:09,960
conference so she would I were talking I

405
00:19:14,779 --> 00:19:12,690
told her that I thought cannabis while

406
00:19:17,480 --> 00:19:14,789
it was becoming more and more popular

407
00:19:19,730 --> 00:19:17,490
and spreading across the cultures there

408
00:19:21,560 --> 00:19:19,740
was this one side of it that I had found

409
00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:21,570
out about through reading and so on

410
00:19:25,789 --> 00:19:23,850
which was that it had an ancient history

411
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:25,799
as a spiritual medicine really ancient

412
00:19:31,250 --> 00:19:27,690
you know ten thousand years at least

413
00:19:33,529 --> 00:19:31,260
that's just what we know but that it

414
00:19:36,919 --> 00:19:33,539
wasn't getting that attention as it

415
00:19:40,340 --> 00:19:36,929
virgin din you know recreational and

416
00:19:42,649 --> 00:19:40,350
medical uses etc etc I said that I

417
00:19:46,399 --> 00:19:42,659
didn't think I had a whole book in it in

418
00:19:48,289 --> 00:19:46,409
myself to write and she said to me well

419
00:19:50,810 --> 00:19:48,299
you know if you put that together as a

420
00:19:53,779 --> 00:19:50,820
project I would promise to contribute a

421
00:19:55,639 --> 00:19:53,789
chapter to it and she's a very wise

422
00:19:56,990 --> 00:19:55,649
person and a beautiful writer and that

423
00:19:59,990 --> 00:19:57,000
was the trigger for me that was five

424
00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:00,000
years ago so then I ended up gathering a

425
00:20:05,810 --> 00:20:02,850
total counting me of 18 contributors to

426
00:20:08,210 --> 00:20:05,820
the book and to answer a question that

427
00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:08,220
you haven't specifically asked yet the

428
00:20:13,730 --> 00:20:11,250
mission the mission of the book is to

429
00:20:15,669 --> 00:20:13,740
redress that issue that cannabis when

430
00:20:18,139 --> 00:20:15,679
used carefully when used wisely

431
00:20:20,090 --> 00:20:18,149
respectfully responsible responsibly

432
00:20:22,220 --> 00:20:20,100
with knowledge about how to use it

433
00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:22,230
because we consider it an advanced

434
00:20:27,769 --> 00:20:25,770
spiritual medicine not you know it's not

435
00:20:30,950 --> 00:20:27,779
like you just take a pill and you know

436
00:20:33,260 --> 00:20:30,960
the world opens up necessarily there are

437
00:20:36,049 --> 00:20:33,270
ways to use it and and so that's what

438
00:20:39,620 --> 00:20:36,059
the purpose of the book is well we need

439
00:20:42,830 --> 00:20:39,630
this it's so necessary I think with

440
00:20:44,389 --> 00:20:42,840
everybody having this to deal with from

441
00:20:46,159 --> 00:20:44,399
the legal side the medical side the

442
00:20:48,049 --> 00:20:46,169
recreational side this has been the

443
00:20:50,090 --> 00:20:48,059
missing piece now here's an interesting

444
00:20:52,940 --> 00:20:50,100
question from our chat room for you

445
00:20:55,919 --> 00:20:52,950
Graham this gentleman says why did

446
00:20:58,200 --> 00:20:55,929
indigenous tribes even consider

447
00:21:01,379 --> 00:20:58,210
to use these drugs as part of their

448
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:01,389
ceremonies how did they know to use it

449
00:21:06,869 --> 00:21:04,210
oh well gee that's a tough question

450
00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:06,879
I think ethno botanist would be able to

451
00:21:12,269 --> 00:21:08,850
answer that one pretty well oftentimes

452
00:21:14,129 --> 00:21:12,279
my understanding and I think is you know

453
00:21:18,619 --> 00:21:14,139
close enough to the truth to be useful

454
00:21:21,119 --> 00:21:18,629
is that before we had grocery stores

455
00:21:24,810 --> 00:21:21,129
which was for most of our history until

456
00:21:27,869 --> 00:21:24,820
extremely recently you needed to know

457
00:21:30,419 --> 00:21:27,879
the uses of every plant in your

458
00:21:33,659 --> 00:21:30,429
neighborhood you needed to know if it

459
00:21:35,810 --> 00:21:33,669
could be used for a building material if

460
00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:35,820
it could be used for clothing for

461
00:21:42,779 --> 00:21:39,970
medicine you to eat it and they weren't

462
00:21:47,039 --> 00:21:42,789
necessarily looking for plants that

463
00:21:49,499 --> 00:21:47,049
would have a spiritual opening potential

464
00:21:52,489 --> 00:21:49,509
but if they ate those plants such as

465
00:21:55,289 --> 00:21:52,499
mushrooms or different things like that

466
00:21:57,299 --> 00:21:55,299
they would certainly find out and

467
00:21:59,279 --> 00:21:57,309
cannabis certainly sits into that

468
00:22:01,769 --> 00:21:59,289
category because it's been around for

469
00:22:03,629 --> 00:22:01,779
well the family from which it comes has

470
00:22:05,129 --> 00:22:03,639
been around for at least thirty million

471
00:22:08,340 --> 00:22:05,139
years on the planet

472
00:22:10,409 --> 00:22:08,350
Wow and so you know if you're in China

473
00:22:12,989 --> 00:22:10,419
where they think it may have originated

474
00:22:14,580 --> 00:22:12,999
from northeastern China perhaps and you

475
00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:14,590
see this plant around you're gonna find

476
00:22:18,509 --> 00:22:16,690
out that what you can do with it and if

477
00:22:20,820 --> 00:22:18,519
you you know if you were to make it into

478
00:22:22,950 --> 00:22:20,830
a tea or you know something like that

479
00:22:24,899 --> 00:22:22,960
you certainly find out what it can do

480
00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:24,909
right so that's one part of the answer

481
00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:28,450
the other sort of grossly oversimplified

482
00:22:32,519 --> 00:22:30,610
version of the answer to your question

483
00:22:34,889 --> 00:22:32,529
about you know in or that person's

484
00:22:36,930 --> 00:22:34,899
question about you know why would

485
00:22:39,749 --> 00:22:36,940
indigenous people you know use these

486
00:22:41,970 --> 00:22:39,759
plants as is it's really difficult to

487
00:22:45,180 --> 00:22:41,980
answer and you know I don't think anyone

488
00:22:46,350 --> 00:22:45,190
now would know for sure but it seems to

489
00:22:48,799 --> 00:22:46,360
me I've read a fair amount of

490
00:22:55,049 --> 00:22:48,809
anthropological literature and so on

491
00:22:56,850 --> 00:22:55,059
that most peoples were had an there was

492
00:23:02,070 --> 00:22:56,860
a I don't know how to put this exactly

493
00:23:04,619 --> 00:23:02,080
really simply the the wall so to speak

494
00:23:08,700 --> 00:23:04,629
between the spirit world and the

495
00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:08,710
material world was pretty thin for a lot

496
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:09,010
of

497
00:23:19,590 --> 00:23:16,450
you know medicinal plants or whatever

498
00:23:21,330 --> 00:23:19,600
people were often in contact with

499
00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:21,340
spirits you know of one kind or another

500
00:23:25,740 --> 00:23:22,570
you know whether you want to call that

501
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:25,750
God or guardian angels or in some cases

502
00:23:31,620 --> 00:23:28,810
even demonic demonic energies even you

503
00:23:33,690 --> 00:23:31,630
know so when people found out that they

504
00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:33,700
could open those doors wide or with you

505
00:23:39,630 --> 00:23:34,810
know with the use of certain specific

506
00:23:42,390 --> 00:23:39,640
plants they would do that here's one

507
00:23:44,460 --> 00:23:42,400
perhaps a summing up of that answer I

508
00:23:47,430 --> 00:23:44,470
think I actually quoted this fellow in

509
00:23:49,170 --> 00:23:47,440
my first book who was a shaman from Peru

510
00:23:51,510 --> 00:23:49,180
and he was at a conference and he said

511
00:23:54,300 --> 00:23:51,520
you know we don't have a problem with

512
00:23:56,610 --> 00:23:54,310
Western science in us in one sense like

513
00:23:58,920 --> 00:23:56,620
we appreciate the things that Western

514
00:24:03,270 --> 00:23:58,930
science has learned about medical issues

515
00:24:06,390 --> 00:24:03,280
but it's only half of the answer the

516
00:24:08,790 --> 00:24:06,400
other half is spirit that when you use a

517
00:24:11,820 --> 00:24:08,800
plant for medicinal purposes or any

518
00:24:13,230 --> 00:24:11,830
purposes healing purposes you ideally

519
00:24:15,210 --> 00:24:13,240
and this is what I think indigenous

520
00:24:18,270 --> 00:24:15,220
people would say all over the world you

521
00:24:21,090 --> 00:24:18,280
connect with the spirit of that plant so

522
00:24:23,130 --> 00:24:21,100
that you bring that in and ayahuasca you

523
00:24:25,890 --> 00:24:23,140
know you mentioned ayahuasca before we

524
00:24:28,740 --> 00:24:25,900
started the conversation on air here

525
00:24:30,360 --> 00:24:28,750
the well-trained ayahuasca arrows the

526
00:24:33,090 --> 00:24:30,370
shamans or whatever you want to call

527
00:24:36,570 --> 00:24:33,100
them they know that they're going to be

528
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:36,580
calling on the spirit or spirits to help

529
00:24:40,050 --> 00:24:38,290
with the work that they're doing that's

530
00:24:43,170 --> 00:24:40,060
what those eco tools are about for

531
00:24:45,540 --> 00:24:43,180
example there i've been told by a shaman

532
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:45,550
in south america an ayahuasca shaman

533
00:24:52,260 --> 00:24:49,090
that the songs are actual beings in a

534
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:52,270
sense that you you learn those songs by

535
00:24:56,310 --> 00:24:54,490
contacting spirit and they teach them to

536
00:24:59,100 --> 00:24:56,320
you and then when you're doing your work

537
00:25:01,470 --> 00:24:59,110
in the ceremony a song will come in and

538
00:25:04,500 --> 00:25:01,480
in a sense say i'm the song for this

539
00:25:07,470 --> 00:25:04,510
situation now right and they have

540
00:25:10,650 --> 00:25:07,480
immense power of that way so I'm getting

541
00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:10,660
perhaps a little off the cannabis topic

542
00:25:14,250 --> 00:25:12,970
here but okay because I think what

543
00:25:16,950 --> 00:25:14,260
you're addressing is where our audience

544
00:25:19,020 --> 00:25:16,960
wants to hear which is how do you

545
00:25:21,450 --> 00:25:19,030
connect with the plant spirit how do you

546
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:21,460
connect you know with this

547
00:25:27,180 --> 00:25:25,210
medicine for the Soul basically and then

548
00:25:28,980 --> 00:25:27,190
and then this you know where does it

549
00:25:31,230 --> 00:25:28,990
take you next I mean this is a very

550
00:25:32,279 --> 00:25:31,240
fascinating topic for everybody in our

551
00:25:35,039 --> 00:25:32,289
audience tonight

552
00:25:36,899 --> 00:25:35,049
now here's another question this is from

553
00:25:38,610 --> 00:25:36,909
Bluebird who wants to know I'd like to

554
00:25:40,620 --> 00:25:38,620
know if any of these plants are

555
00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:40,630
protected by local governments in

556
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:43,690
certain parts of the world well we're

557
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:45,010
definitely getting beyond just the

558
00:25:52,980 --> 00:25:48,610
cannabis issue here so maybe maybe I'll

559
00:25:55,769 --> 00:25:52,990
just briefly say that I think that

560
00:25:57,930 --> 00:25:55,779
within maybe twenty years or so

561
00:26:00,000 --> 00:25:57,940
cannabis is going to be legal in a great

562
00:26:03,510 --> 00:26:00,010
number of jurisdictions right now

563
00:26:08,120 --> 00:26:03,520
Uruguay has made it legal for their own

564
00:26:11,120 --> 00:26:08,130
citizens Portugal has decriminalized all

565
00:26:14,250 --> 00:26:11,130
psychedelics all drugs essentially

566
00:26:17,010 --> 00:26:14,260
Europe is in various stages of moving

567
00:26:19,649 --> 00:26:17,020
toward this Canada is about to have

568
00:26:21,899 --> 00:26:19,659
across-the-board federal federally

569
00:26:25,049 --> 00:26:21,909
approved legalization for all uses of

570
00:26:27,419 --> 00:26:25,059
marijuana for adults the United States

571
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:27,429
as I'm sure you know most of your

572
00:26:34,620 --> 00:26:30,570
listeners know has at least six states

573
00:26:37,230 --> 00:26:34,630
with with recreational legal marijuana

574
00:26:40,409 --> 00:26:37,240
and thirty I believe it is with medical

575
00:26:43,769 --> 00:26:40,419
marijuana legalized so it's changing

576
00:26:46,230 --> 00:26:43,779
rapidly and and so that's that I think

577
00:26:47,370 --> 00:26:46,240
we can be optimistic about because it's

578
00:26:49,500 --> 00:26:47,380
going to what people are going to find

579
00:26:51,810 --> 00:26:49,510
out is it's not there nearly the big

580
00:26:54,299 --> 00:26:51,820
deal that everyone was you know in in

581
00:26:56,100 --> 00:26:54,309
positions of conservative Authority so

582
00:26:58,919 --> 00:26:56,110
to speak were concerned about

583
00:27:01,080 --> 00:26:58,929
it'll just be kind of you know a normal

584
00:27:04,620 --> 00:27:01,090
thing after a while you know Holland for

585
00:27:07,620 --> 00:27:04,630
example has had de facto legalization of

586
00:27:09,299 --> 00:27:07,630
cannabis not actual legalization because

587
00:27:12,630 --> 00:27:09,309
they're part of the EU and it's not

588
00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:12,640
allowed the European Union but they've

589
00:27:17,130 --> 00:27:14,770
they they have these you know

590
00:27:20,730 --> 00:27:17,140
quote-unquote coffee shops and they've

591
00:27:23,669 --> 00:27:20,740
had them for 40 or more years and so

592
00:27:26,039 --> 00:27:23,679
it's it's not stigmatized they're

593
00:27:27,930 --> 00:27:26,049
essentially and it's easily accessible

594
00:27:31,230 --> 00:27:27,940
and the percentage of the population

595
00:27:32,940 --> 00:27:31,240
that uses cannabis is significantly

596
00:27:34,799 --> 00:27:32,950
lower than it has been all of these

597
00:27:35,460 --> 00:27:34,809
years in Canada in the United States

598
00:27:38,909 --> 00:27:35,470
where it's

599
00:27:41,070 --> 00:27:38,919
illegal right so right my Mike my take

600
00:27:43,289 --> 00:27:41,080
on that is that once this once the

601
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:43,299
novelty is passed once the stigma is out

602
00:27:47,610 --> 00:27:45,490
of the way and it's been around for a

603
00:27:48,570 --> 00:27:47,620
while it'll kind of settle things will

604
00:27:51,419 --> 00:27:48,580
settle down

605
00:27:53,250 --> 00:27:51,429
you know laws will relax a little more

606
00:27:54,570 --> 00:27:53,260
people will be able to decide for

607
00:27:57,270 --> 00:27:54,580
themselves and a lot of people will just

608
00:27:59,070 --> 00:27:57,280
go well okay I it's not actually my it's

609
00:28:01,680 --> 00:27:59,080
not the plant for me I don't I don't I'm

610
00:28:08,460 --> 00:28:01,690
not interested you know so that's that's

611
00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:08,470
cannabis psilocybin mushrooms I except

612
00:28:11,940 --> 00:28:10,450
for a you know again places like

613
00:28:16,260 --> 00:28:11,950
Portugal where they've be criminalized

614
00:28:19,340 --> 00:28:16,270
all drugs I don't believe I know of any

615
00:28:22,370 --> 00:28:19,350
jurisdictions where that is legal now

616
00:28:26,460 --> 00:28:22,380
ayahuasca is a really interesting one

617
00:28:28,799 --> 00:28:26,470
because there are churches that stem

618
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:28,809
from Brazil there are at least three of

619
00:28:34,830 --> 00:28:31,690
them the best-known is called the Santo

620
00:28:36,510 --> 00:28:34,840
Daime II religion and they have many

621
00:28:38,760 --> 00:28:36,520
many adherents and they've been

622
00:28:41,220 --> 00:28:38,770
spreading around the world and they've

623
00:28:44,279 --> 00:28:41,230
been gaining levels of legal recognition

624
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:44,289
there they won a Supreme Court decision

625
00:28:49,169 --> 00:28:45,970
in Oregon for example where a very

626
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:49,179
particular Church has been given

627
00:28:53,820 --> 00:28:51,130
permission to legally have their

628
00:28:55,470 --> 00:28:53,830
ceremonies with ayahuasca they call it

629
00:28:55,950 --> 00:28:55,480
the die me they call the medicine the

630
00:28:59,789 --> 00:28:55,960
die me

631
00:29:01,950 --> 00:28:59,799
and there's move toward that in Canada

632
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:01,960
Canada there I don't specifically know

633
00:29:06,510 --> 00:29:04,450
but there are jurisdictions in Europe I

634
00:29:08,070 --> 00:29:06,520
think that are kind of close to that at

635
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:08,080
this point

636
00:29:13,919 --> 00:29:11,890
then there's the peyote yes that's

637
00:29:16,470 --> 00:29:13,929
another one well we're gonna get get to

638
00:29:18,570 --> 00:29:16,480
all of the spiritual side of this and

639
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:18,580
how people can do this how they can if

640
00:29:23,580 --> 00:29:21,730
this is something for them then and

641
00:29:26,159 --> 00:29:23,590
again like you said for some people this

642
00:29:28,260 --> 00:29:26,169
is not a good thing but there are people

643
00:29:31,620 --> 00:29:28,270
who this will really work for and

644
00:29:32,460 --> 00:29:31,630
connect to a spiritual soul path like

645
00:29:34,289 --> 00:29:32,470
none other

646
00:29:35,490 --> 00:29:34,299
so we're going to get to all of that

647
00:29:39,029 --> 00:29:35,500
we're going to take a very short

648
00:29:41,159 --> 00:29:39,039
commercial break and we will be right

649
00:29:42,690 --> 00:29:41,169
back so listen everybody this is a great

650
00:29:44,669 --> 00:29:42,700
show you're gonna learn a lot from

651
00:29:47,580 --> 00:29:44,679
Steven gray he's the author of the book

652
00:29:48,620 --> 00:29:47,590
cannabis and spirituality he's actually

653
00:29:50,420 --> 00:29:48,630
the editor

654
00:29:54,050 --> 00:29:50,430
but he also has his own Shafter in here

655
00:29:56,420 --> 00:29:54,060
that he wrote so so we're gonna come

656
00:29:58,730 --> 00:29:56,430
back and and just unwrap all of this

657
00:30:01,040 --> 00:29:58,740
beautiful information you are listening

658
00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:01,050
to Supernatural girls radio and we will

659
00:30:05,690 --> 00:30:03,330
be right back natural girls radio I'm

660
00:30:09,050 --> 00:30:05,700
your host for Tricia Baker I'm here with

661
00:30:11,810 --> 00:30:09,060
my lovely co-host from Tucson pk

662
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:11,820
you can visit PK online at patricia

663
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:14,250
Kirkman comm if you want to see what's

664
00:30:19,580 --> 00:30:16,890
coming up for you in 2018 she is the

665
00:30:23,900 --> 00:30:19,590
woman to speak with so go to Patricia

666
00:30:27,740 --> 00:30:23,910
Kirkman dot-com so tonight we are having

667
00:30:30,710 --> 00:30:27,750
a very interesting discussion a lot of

668
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:30,720
information and it's about cannabis and

669
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:32,370
spirituality and now we're going to go

670
00:30:37,130 --> 00:30:35,250
more into spiritual awakening the

671
00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:37,140
spiritual awakening how does that happen

672
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:39,450
with cannabis Stephen can you talk to us

673
00:30:47,090 --> 00:30:44,370
about that sure so I think the first

674
00:30:50,570 --> 00:30:47,100
thing that want to lay the ground but

675
00:30:53,540 --> 00:30:50,580
that is you know I'm like never reached

676
00:30:56,800 --> 00:30:53,550
the end of the line with me but I have

677
00:30:59,690 --> 00:30:56,810
been working with spirit many years and

678
00:31:02,960 --> 00:30:59,700
meditation and so on as well as various

679
00:31:06,370 --> 00:31:02,970
dialects or entheogen says prefer call

680
00:31:09,620 --> 00:31:06,380
them and I certainly add a lot as well

681
00:31:14,330 --> 00:31:09,630
my sense of what spiritual awakening is

682
00:31:18,020 --> 00:31:14,340
is that there is a uncontained really

683
00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:18,030
there's nothing to do with believe about

684
00:31:28,670 --> 00:31:20,730
what is brew or not true or real or not

685
00:31:32,660 --> 00:31:28,680
Buhler good or bad you know we're having

686
00:31:33,830 --> 00:31:32,670
a little problem technically I don't

687
00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:33,840
know if your internet connection is

688
00:31:38,060 --> 00:31:36,330
overloaded but let's see if we can maybe

689
00:31:39,860 --> 00:31:38,070
start over because that you broke up

690
00:31:43,310 --> 00:31:39,870
through that our explanation of

691
00:31:45,650 --> 00:31:43,320
spiritual awakening so let's try this

692
00:31:49,310 --> 00:31:45,660
again and see if we can hear what you

693
00:31:51,380 --> 00:31:49,320
have to say sure yeah okay so I felt

694
00:31:53,300 --> 00:31:51,390
like that I should start with my

695
00:31:56,120 --> 00:31:53,310
understanding of what spiritual

696
00:31:59,900 --> 00:31:56,130
awakening is and that comes from a lot

697
00:32:01,790 --> 00:31:59,910
of study and practice and my sense is my

698
00:32:02,390 --> 00:32:01,800
understanding is that there is something

699
00:32:04,460 --> 00:32:02,400
that you

700
00:32:06,710 --> 00:32:04,470
call unconditioned or unconditional

701
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:06,720
reality that every human being is

702
00:32:12,770 --> 00:32:10,010
capable of in a sense falling into or

703
00:32:14,930 --> 00:32:12,780
relaxing into it's not something that

704
00:32:18,260 --> 00:32:14,940
you create in a sense it's something

705
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:18,270
that you remove obstacles to and that's

706
00:32:22,970 --> 00:32:20,250
what that's what the word Buddha

707
00:32:25,580 --> 00:32:22,980
actually means and Buddha means awake

708
00:32:28,190 --> 00:32:25,590
and the Buddhist teachings say that

709
00:32:29,990 --> 00:32:28,200
everybody has food in nature okay so

710
00:32:33,500 --> 00:32:30,000
that's that's the the kind of the ground

711
00:32:35,660 --> 00:32:33,510
and the reason that people are not what

712
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:35,670
you might call awake or enlightened is

713
00:32:41,180 --> 00:32:38,490
because we create a whole bunch of

714
00:32:42,950 --> 00:32:41,190
obstacles for ourselves through our the

715
00:32:45,620 --> 00:32:42,960
stories that we tell ourselves the

716
00:32:47,660 --> 00:32:45,630
beliefs and concepts that we ship on

717
00:32:49,430 --> 00:32:47,670
from you know the people around us as

718
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:49,440
we're growing up and develop into our

719
00:32:55,100 --> 00:32:53,250
own narrative about who we are what's

720
00:33:00,350 --> 00:32:55,110
real what's not real and so on right

721
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:00,360
what's true untrue right yeah but that's

722
00:33:04,100 --> 00:33:02,370
what you might call a fictional that's

723
00:33:06,590 --> 00:33:04,110
you know the Buddhist teachings call it

724
00:33:08,950 --> 00:33:06,600
and you lose an illusion of this of the

725
00:33:11,420 --> 00:33:08,960
separate self that's disconnected from

726
00:33:12,650 --> 00:33:11,430
you know from everything oh you know

727
00:33:14,930 --> 00:33:12,660
that's what they mean when they talk

728
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:14,940
about oneness that when you are able to

729
00:33:19,490 --> 00:33:16,290
let go

730
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:19,500
surrender release these you know

731
00:33:25,790 --> 00:33:23,490
boundaries and walls and bonds that we

732
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:25,800
kind of place around ourselves then you

733
00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:27,570
start to discover that you actually are

734
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:31,290
more gradually usually discover that

735
00:33:36,830 --> 00:33:33,450
you're connected to everything in that

736
00:33:39,860 --> 00:33:36,840
sense and that at the root of that is an

737
00:33:41,990 --> 00:33:39,870
unconditioned unambiguous sense of peace

738
00:33:44,180 --> 00:33:42,000
that's what the word peace actually

739
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:44,190
means is that you can you can just

740
00:33:50,690 --> 00:33:46,890
settle down into this place that's real

741
00:33:52,730 --> 00:33:50,700
and it Buddhist teachings also say that

742
00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:52,740
enlightenment synonym for that is

743
00:33:57,610 --> 00:33:55,890
awakened heart so your heart wakes up

744
00:33:59,660 --> 00:33:57,620
with that - and you develop

745
00:34:03,050 --> 00:33:59,670
unconditional compassion or

746
00:34:05,780 --> 00:34:03,060
unconditioned compassion so without as a

747
00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:05,790
kind of a ground the question is then

748
00:34:12,860 --> 00:34:09,210
how can cannabis help with that right so

749
00:34:15,290 --> 00:34:12,870
yeah the starting point is to describe

750
00:34:17,410 --> 00:34:15,300
it as an amplifier

751
00:34:20,720 --> 00:34:17,420
what you might call a nonspecific

752
00:34:26,510 --> 00:34:20,730
amplifier so you might say it's a gift

753
00:34:29,690 --> 00:34:26,520
of amplified a sharper vaster energy in

754
00:34:31,130 --> 00:34:29,700
a sense that if you do it well and we

755
00:34:33,020 --> 00:34:31,140
can talk about that I think we should

756
00:34:36,020 --> 00:34:33,030
talk about that as we go forward here

757
00:34:38,090 --> 00:34:36,030
yes absolutely yeah if you use it

758
00:34:42,830 --> 00:34:38,100
properly if you understand the principle

759
00:34:45,830 --> 00:34:42,840
of what you're doing that can deepen and

760
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:45,840
expand whatever your intention is so

761
00:34:49,340 --> 00:34:47,610
that's another issue that we could

762
00:34:50,750 --> 00:34:49,350
probably should probably talk about as

763
00:34:53,169 --> 00:34:50,760
we go along too is that if your

764
00:34:56,330 --> 00:34:53,179
intention is either unconscious or

765
00:34:58,550 --> 00:34:56,340
consciously just to escape cannabis can

766
00:35:02,210 --> 00:34:58,560
amplify that kind of intention as well

767
00:35:05,660 --> 00:35:02,220
however if your intention is to wake up

768
00:35:09,050 --> 00:35:05,670
to heal then it can open you up in that

769
00:35:11,720 --> 00:35:09,060
way it can deepen your experience so I

770
00:35:13,850 --> 00:35:11,730
think an important thing to do to point

771
00:35:15,710 --> 00:35:13,860
out well for those who are interested at

772
00:35:18,460 --> 00:35:15,720
least is you know how that works

773
00:35:21,500 --> 00:35:18,470
biochemically it's referred to as the

774
00:35:24,290 --> 00:35:21,510
pharmacokinetics pharmacokinetics means

775
00:35:27,710 --> 00:35:24,300
the the action of a drug or substance as

776
00:35:30,670 --> 00:35:27,720
it enters the body how it's processed in

777
00:35:32,990 --> 00:35:30,680
the body and how it leaves the body so

778
00:35:34,820 --> 00:35:33,000
one of the chapters in the book is by

779
00:35:37,580 --> 00:35:34,830
Joan Bello who has a very interesting

780
00:35:40,130 --> 00:35:37,590
description of how that works and she

781
00:35:46,340 --> 00:35:40,140
says that when you first smoke it or

782
00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:46,350
vaporize it edible oral ingestion being

783
00:35:50,690 --> 00:35:47,850
a different case altogether because it

784
00:35:52,850 --> 00:35:50,700
can take up to two hours to reach full

785
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:52,860
effects when you take it orally but if

786
00:35:57,100 --> 00:35:55,290
you smoke or vaporize cannabis the

787
00:35:59,540 --> 00:35:57,110
effects are to all intents and purposes

788
00:36:01,880 --> 00:35:59,550
immediate you know within seconds or a

789
00:36:03,410 --> 00:36:01,890
minute or two or whatever and so when

790
00:36:06,650 --> 00:36:03,420
you do that

791
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:06,660
your heart speeds up somewhat there's an

792
00:36:12,310 --> 00:36:08,370
increase in heart rate that's well known

793
00:36:16,390 --> 00:36:12,320
and well recorded and a subsequent

794
00:36:20,570 --> 00:36:16,400
pumping of fresh rich freshly oxygenated

795
00:36:24,740 --> 00:36:20,580
blood throughout the organism and a

796
00:36:27,020 --> 00:36:24,750
concomitant relaxing of the skeletal or

797
00:36:28,620 --> 00:36:27,030
oppositional muscles that's Joan bellows

798
00:36:31,140 --> 00:36:28,630
phrase for it scale

799
00:36:33,720 --> 00:36:31,150
oppositional muscles so the whole

800
00:36:36,210 --> 00:36:33,730
organism is becomes more highly charged

801
00:36:38,130 --> 00:36:36,220
if you're paying attention to it as

802
00:36:40,170 --> 00:36:38,140
everybody who has ever been around

803
00:36:41,820 --> 00:36:40,180
cannabis either for themselves or other

804
00:36:44,610 --> 00:36:41,830
people knows you can distract yourself

805
00:36:46,620 --> 00:36:44,620
and you can just busy your mind you can

806
00:36:48,660 --> 00:36:46,630
do have things going on all the time but

807
00:36:50,460 --> 00:36:48,670
if you more or less kind of sit down

808
00:36:51,930 --> 00:36:50,470
shut up and pay attention which is a

809
00:36:56,610 --> 00:36:51,940
phrase from Terence Mckenna who I

810
00:36:59,370 --> 00:36:56,620
mentioned earlier and you you can see

811
00:37:01,010 --> 00:36:59,380
that it can potentially it has a lot to

812
00:37:03,870 --> 00:37:01,020
do with getting out of your head right

813
00:37:07,140 --> 00:37:03,880
so if you can and this is a basic

814
00:37:08,700 --> 00:37:07,150
spiritual principle anyway in Buddhism

815
00:37:11,370 --> 00:37:08,710
and other traditions talk about getting

816
00:37:13,020 --> 00:37:11,380
out of your own way letting go of this

817
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:13,030
narrative that I mentioned a few moments

818
00:37:16,770 --> 00:37:15,130
ago of thoughts constantly coming

819
00:37:19,710 --> 00:37:16,780
through in fact Buddhist teachings say

820
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:19,720
that our thoughts are the primary kind

821
00:37:26,250 --> 00:37:23,130
of strategy or tactic that we use to

822
00:37:28,380 --> 00:37:26,260
create and preserve this fortress this

823
00:37:30,690 --> 00:37:28,390
wall that we create around ourselves so

824
00:37:33,450 --> 00:37:30,700
that we can maintain this seemingly

825
00:37:39,210 --> 00:37:33,460
comforting illusion of the separate self

826
00:37:41,430 --> 00:37:39,220
so cannabis can help dissolve that yeah

827
00:37:44,460 --> 00:37:41,440
they can the walls the hardness the

828
00:37:47,460 --> 00:37:44,470
bonds etc etc but again needs to be

829
00:37:49,110 --> 00:37:47,470
channeled that way so if you understand

830
00:37:52,140 --> 00:37:49,120
or accept this principle of the

831
00:37:55,050 --> 00:37:52,150
nonspecific amplifier then the next

832
00:37:57,930 --> 00:37:55,060
question for me is how do you apply that

833
00:38:00,660 --> 00:37:57,940
you know so I mentioned the sit down

834
00:38:03,060 --> 00:38:00,670
shut up and pay attention idea that's

835
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:03,070
essentially another that's a synonym for

836
00:38:07,860 --> 00:38:05,890
meditating really and when I say

837
00:38:09,750 --> 00:38:07,870
meditating I don't mean contemplating I

838
00:38:11,750 --> 00:38:09,760
mean what Buddhist teachings and others

839
00:38:15,300 --> 00:38:11,760
wouldn't refer to as meditation which is

840
00:38:17,010 --> 00:38:15,310
the simplest version is you just sit you

841
00:38:19,140 --> 00:38:17,020
try to sit up straight so that your

842
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:19,150
energy moves easily you know what some

843
00:38:23,010 --> 00:38:20,530
people might call the Kundalini energy

844
00:38:24,810 --> 00:38:23,020
or whatever and you're not gonna you're

845
00:38:26,580 --> 00:38:24,820
not gonna tire as fast as you would if

846
00:38:30,630 --> 00:38:26,590
you're slouching over or whatever and

847
00:38:34,020 --> 00:38:30,640
you just pay attention so in the way

848
00:38:36,930 --> 00:38:34,030
meditation was taught to me you use the

849
00:38:38,700 --> 00:38:36,940
breath as the as the the anchor back

850
00:38:41,310 --> 00:38:38,710
into reality because it's part of the

851
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:41,320
autonomic nervous system it it you don't

852
00:38:45,540 --> 00:38:42,490
think about your breath

853
00:38:47,550 --> 00:38:45,550
most of the time right and so so if you

854
00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:47,560
pay attention to it in a in a light way

855
00:38:52,950 --> 00:38:50,530
not over hyper focus but just it brings

856
00:38:55,710 --> 00:38:52,960
you back into the full presence of this

857
00:38:58,020 --> 00:38:55,720
moment and then inevitably thoughts come

858
00:38:59,220 --> 00:38:58,030
up you're off and never Neverland or

859
00:39:02,190 --> 00:38:59,230
whatever thinking about tomorrow

860
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:02,200
yesterday or whatever and then when you

861
00:39:08,180 --> 00:39:03,970
recognize that you just kind of let it

862
00:39:10,859 --> 00:39:08,190
go and come back to being present well

863
00:39:14,690 --> 00:39:10,869
because I know our audience is thinking

864
00:39:18,359 --> 00:39:14,700
about here and so you do your meditation

865
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:18,369
on the heels of taking marijuana I mean

866
00:39:22,620 --> 00:39:20,410
I'm taking cannabis is that how you do

867
00:39:24,900 --> 00:39:22,630
this or do you use it after your

868
00:39:26,970 --> 00:39:24,910
meditation how what are the mechanics of

869
00:39:28,859 --> 00:39:26,980
it that's what they want to know well

870
00:39:31,260 --> 00:39:28,869
one answer to that question is that it's

871
00:39:33,420 --> 00:39:31,270
as is as I said a few times in the book

872
00:39:35,940 --> 00:39:33,430
it's the people's plant so it's very

873
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:35,950
amenable and gracious to experimenting

874
00:39:40,620 --> 00:39:37,330
with so there are lots of different ways

875
00:39:42,330 --> 00:39:40,630
to work with the plant that way in I

876
00:39:45,300 --> 00:39:42,340
just wanted to say about meditation is

877
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:45,310
that the idea is that as much as

878
00:39:50,609 --> 00:39:47,770
possible we open a gap in the ongoing

879
00:39:54,240 --> 00:39:50,619
thinking mind right and then we

880
00:39:56,460 --> 00:39:54,250
gradually hopefully surrender or relax

881
00:40:00,210 --> 00:39:56,470
into the unconditioned awakened state

882
00:40:03,060 --> 00:40:00,220
and in degrees and so what cannabis

883
00:40:06,380 --> 00:40:03,070
being a nonspecific amplifier can

884
00:40:10,710 --> 00:40:06,390
actually heighten and deepen that

885
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:10,720
process okay so yes there's lots of

886
00:40:14,940 --> 00:40:12,970
different ways to do it for example you

887
00:40:17,190 --> 00:40:14,950
might meditate for a while first just to

888
00:40:19,230 --> 00:40:17,200
calm yourself down and it's not just

889
00:40:21,150 --> 00:40:19,240
meditation this is just kind of I like

890
00:40:22,859 --> 00:40:21,160
to think of this simple kind of fall of

891
00:40:26,460 --> 00:40:22,869
the breath kind of meditation as the

892
00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:26,470
sort of the purest way of working with

893
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:29,290
it because everybody has so much of an

894
00:40:34,770 --> 00:40:31,810
issue with the thinking mind that if we

895
00:40:37,590 --> 00:40:34,780
can simplify our unique the container

896
00:40:39,510 --> 00:40:37,600
you might say that we're in and remove

897
00:40:40,530 --> 00:40:39,520
distractions and just sit down shut up

898
00:40:42,630 --> 00:40:40,540
and pay attention

899
00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:42,640
then we can really find out what this

900
00:40:47,670 --> 00:40:44,530
medicine can do when you get out of your

901
00:40:49,230 --> 00:40:47,680
own way so you might meditate for a

902
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:49,240
while first you might do some other

903
00:40:55,569 --> 00:40:51,970
calming practices yoga tai chi whatever

904
00:40:57,910 --> 00:40:55,579
that's one way you could do it and and

905
00:40:59,650 --> 00:40:57,920
and you might as Kathleen Harrison in

906
00:41:02,079 --> 00:40:59,660
her chapter it makes a point of saying

907
00:41:04,089 --> 00:41:02,089
you might treat it with great respect

908
00:41:06,009 --> 00:41:04,099
and if you do that you're more likely to

909
00:41:07,930 --> 00:41:06,019
receive benefit from the plant if you

910
00:41:10,089 --> 00:41:07,940
treat it even even though you might not

911
00:41:13,359 --> 00:41:10,099
have had experience with it as a spirit

912
00:41:15,759 --> 00:41:13,369
or you know anything like that if you if

913
00:41:17,469 --> 00:41:15,769
you think me I'm just kind of like fake

914
00:41:20,289 --> 00:41:17,479
it till you make it kind of approach

915
00:41:22,449 --> 00:41:20,299
it's like what if there is what if there

916
00:41:25,390 --> 00:41:22,459
is a spirit behind this plant because as

917
00:41:27,069 --> 00:41:25,400
Kathleen Harrison says indigenous people

918
00:41:29,799 --> 00:41:27,079
that she's known she's a world renowned

919
00:41:31,359 --> 00:41:29,809
in certain circles ethno botanist and

920
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:31,369
has spent much time with indigenous

921
00:41:36,279 --> 00:41:33,410
people and who those people would say

922
00:41:39,309 --> 00:41:36,289
things like there's a mother of every

923
00:41:41,140 --> 00:41:39,319
plant species it's like the overseeing

924
00:41:43,180 --> 00:41:41,150
spirit in the sense of that plant

925
00:41:45,969 --> 00:41:43,190
species and it's possible to contact

926
00:41:47,620 --> 00:41:45,979
that spirit and I could if we had time I

927
00:41:49,539 --> 00:41:47,630
could tell you some stories about people

928
00:41:52,539 --> 00:41:49,549
who say they have contacted the spirit

929
00:41:54,130 --> 00:41:52,549
of cannabis in that regard and yeah can

930
00:41:55,930 --> 00:41:54,140
you give us one of those stories what is

931
00:41:58,180 --> 00:41:55,940
that like I mean when they have that

932
00:42:00,279 --> 00:41:58,190
experience of reaching out that way and

933
00:42:03,069 --> 00:42:00,289
they actually make contact okay I'll

934
00:42:05,410 --> 00:42:03,079
tell you my favorite one then there's

935
00:42:07,569 --> 00:42:05,420
there's a he was a leader of a spiritual

936
00:42:09,699 --> 00:42:07,579
community that worked with ayahuasca in

937
00:42:12,789 --> 00:42:09,709
Brazil and they were way out in the

938
00:42:15,370 --> 00:42:12,799
jungle this is back in the 70s I believe

939
00:42:19,180 --> 00:42:15,380
and he did not he was not familiar with

940
00:42:21,430 --> 00:42:19,190
cannabis it wasn't around there but but

941
00:42:21,910 --> 00:42:21,440
this community was starting to get known

942
00:42:26,140 --> 00:42:21,920
and

943
00:42:29,439 --> 00:42:26,150
some young hippie guy arrived at his

944
00:42:31,660 --> 00:42:29,449
encampment and had some pot with him and

945
00:42:34,299 --> 00:42:31,670
felt kind of embarrassed about it so he

946
00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:34,309
went to the leader guy and said you know

947
00:42:37,269 --> 00:42:35,930
I've got this stuff with me I'm not sure

948
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:37,279
what I should do with it I don't want to

949
00:42:40,630 --> 00:42:38,930
be disrespectful and the leader said oh

950
00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:40,640
give it to me and I'll find out for

951
00:42:45,789 --> 00:42:42,650
myself so he went and had a little

952
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:45,799
private one you know solo ceremony with

953
00:42:55,630 --> 00:42:52,729
it and he said that he had a vision and

954
00:42:57,849 --> 00:42:55,640
the vision was that he found himself in

955
00:43:00,609 --> 00:42:57,859
a garden and there was a woman tending

956
00:43:03,579 --> 00:43:00,619
the garden and she saw him there and she

957
00:43:07,989 --> 00:43:03,589
turned to him and said this is unpair of

958
00:43:08,990 --> 00:43:07,999
course she said to him you're in my

959
00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:09,000
garden this is

960
00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:11,130
garden and that plant that you smoked

961
00:43:15,620 --> 00:43:12,810
that's my plant and it's here in my

962
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:15,630
garden and if you choose to in your

963
00:43:20,150 --> 00:43:17,970
position of responsibility what you

964
00:43:21,980 --> 00:43:20,160
could do is help people understand that

965
00:43:22,970 --> 00:43:21,990
this is actually a spiritual medicine

966
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:22,980
and that a lot of people don't

967
00:43:26,540 --> 00:43:24,930
understand that and misuse it and it

968
00:43:29,030 --> 00:43:26,550
actually can be harmful in their lives

969
00:43:31,460 --> 00:43:29,040
if they misuse it so it needs to be

970
00:43:33,560 --> 00:43:31,470
returned to its its its proper role

971
00:43:36,590 --> 00:43:33,570
which is as a sacred medicine that

972
00:43:39,020 --> 00:43:36,600
belongs to the spirit in a sense and so

973
00:43:41,450 --> 00:43:39,030
because this community that he was

974
00:43:43,310 --> 00:43:41,460
involved in was in a syncretic religion

975
00:43:45,740 --> 00:43:43,320
that hadn't included indigenous

976
00:43:49,310 --> 00:43:45,750
components as well as Christian elements

977
00:43:52,820 --> 00:43:49,320
he dubbed her Santa Maria Saint Mary

978
00:43:55,670 --> 00:43:52,830
and so they they actually call cannabis

979
00:43:59,410 --> 00:43:55,680
Santa Maria now so they actually call it

980
00:44:02,780 --> 00:43:59,420
by the name of the same fascinating yes

981
00:44:05,030 --> 00:44:02,790
great story yeah yeah so there is that

982
00:44:08,690 --> 00:44:05,040
so then coming back to the practice

983
00:44:11,180 --> 00:44:08,700
element if I may the simplest way to

984
00:44:13,940 --> 00:44:11,190
meet cannabis and and in a sense the

985
00:44:15,860 --> 00:44:13,950
most difficult because it is an advanced

986
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:15,870
spiritual medicine it is raising the

987
00:44:20,900 --> 00:44:18,810
stakes it's an amplifier you know and so

988
00:44:23,360 --> 00:44:20,910
it's actually a challenge to do that

989
00:44:25,190 --> 00:44:23,370
it's it's like meditation plus or

990
00:44:26,810 --> 00:44:25,200
something in a sense you know it's the

991
00:44:29,090 --> 00:44:26,820
same principle it's the same trajectory

992
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:29,100
it's the same practice but it can be

993
00:44:34,150 --> 00:44:30,810
more challenging because it actually

994
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:34,160
wants to dissolve this you know illusory

995
00:44:39,110 --> 00:44:36,690
you know structure that you've built you

996
00:44:41,990 --> 00:44:39,120
know and soften you up that way but if

997
00:44:43,310 --> 00:44:42,000
you can do that then there's much reward

998
00:44:46,070 --> 00:44:43,320
that can come of it

999
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:46,080
so so simply sitting down for part of

1000
00:44:49,370 --> 00:44:47,490
the time at least that you work with

1001
00:44:51,080 --> 00:44:49,380
cannabis and doing uh some kind of

1002
00:44:55,190 --> 00:44:51,090
simple meditation can be very very

1003
00:44:58,310 --> 00:44:55,200
useful I think but it can also help with

1004
00:45:01,250 --> 00:44:58,320
a variety of other what you might call

1005
00:45:03,530 --> 00:45:01,260
more form based practices like yoga tai

1006
00:45:05,750 --> 00:45:03,540
chi and some others I just hope that

1007
00:45:07,460 --> 00:45:05,760
people will let go of their dog like oh

1008
00:45:09,470 --> 00:45:07,470
no no it can't mix those you know

1009
00:45:11,330 --> 00:45:09,480
there's people like that you know like

1010
00:45:13,610 --> 00:45:11,340
oh no God my god you can't corrupt Tai

1011
00:45:16,340 --> 00:45:13,620
Chi by having cannabis or a drug

1012
00:45:18,890 --> 00:45:16,350
involved but if you just treat it as a

1013
00:45:21,410 --> 00:45:18,900
spirit as a respectful sacred plant and

1014
00:45:22,520 --> 00:45:21,420
think of it as a neutral substance a

1015
00:45:25,700 --> 00:45:22,530
nonspecific

1016
00:45:26,900 --> 00:45:25,710
amplifier it can deepen your practice if

1017
00:45:29,450 --> 00:45:26,910
you can do it with some kind of

1018
00:45:31,340 --> 00:45:29,460
channeled focus intention and discipline

1019
00:45:34,250 --> 00:45:31,350
in that regard but let me ask you a

1020
00:45:35,750 --> 00:45:34,260
question Steven this is there are as you

1021
00:45:38,890 --> 00:45:35,760
know a lot of people now you've

1022
00:45:42,620 --> 00:45:38,900
mentioned 30 states that have it as

1023
00:45:44,540 --> 00:45:42,630
legal for medical use now what I'm

1024
00:45:46,790 --> 00:45:44,550
thinking is there's absolutely no reason

1025
00:45:49,970 --> 00:45:46,800
why people who are using it to alleviate

1026
00:45:53,060 --> 00:45:49,980
pain or seizures or whatever the issue

1027
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:53,070
is that they're using this for they can

1028
00:45:59,330 --> 00:45:55,490
also incorporate the spiritual element

1029
00:46:02,120 --> 00:45:59,340
to their use so they can also if they so

1030
00:46:05,270 --> 00:46:02,130
choose take it beyond the medical use

1031
00:46:07,580 --> 00:46:05,280
into when they're administering it in

1032
00:46:08,210 --> 00:46:07,590
whatever form they can also set their

1033
00:46:11,210 --> 00:46:08,220
intent

1034
00:46:14,690 --> 00:46:11,220
they can also be open to this spiritual

1035
00:46:16,190 --> 00:46:14,700
awakening right of course yeah I think

1036
00:46:18,700 --> 00:46:16,200
an important point about that it's a

1037
00:46:21,020 --> 00:46:18,710
difficult one because if you're using

1038
00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:21,030
cannabis for medicinal reasons you may

1039
00:46:27,230 --> 00:46:23,010
have to be using it not just daily but

1040
00:46:30,140 --> 00:46:27,240
several times a day so you know nobody

1041
00:46:34,840 --> 00:46:30,150
should be you know chastised or

1042
00:46:40,130 --> 00:46:37,220
what a number of the contributors to the

1043
00:46:42,950 --> 00:46:40,140
book all feel or believe from their

1044
00:46:46,010 --> 00:46:42,960
experience is that if you can use it

1045
00:46:47,900 --> 00:46:46,020
less frequently it's going to likely be

1046
00:46:50,210 --> 00:46:47,910
more effective as a spiritual medicine

1047
00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:50,220
in terms of being able to go deeper with

1048
00:46:54,500 --> 00:46:52,410
it because there's a tolerance effect

1049
00:46:58,040 --> 00:46:54,510
that most people experience when you use

1050
00:47:00,050 --> 00:46:58,050
it daily and I can and so the sharpness

1051
00:47:02,540 --> 00:47:00,060
and the depth of it can be missing in

1052
00:47:04,940 --> 00:47:02,550
that way it's a it's a bit tricky you

1053
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:04,950
know in that regard because I know

1054
00:47:09,530 --> 00:47:07,530
people personally who who are not using

1055
00:47:12,590 --> 00:47:09,540
it for what you might narrowly define as

1056
00:47:16,880 --> 00:47:12,600
medicinal use but do do it every day and

1057
00:47:19,310 --> 00:47:16,890
I can't say that there's some you know

1058
00:47:20,690 --> 00:47:19,320
as I say personal friends that use it

1059
00:47:22,310 --> 00:47:20,700
that way and they're very effective in

1060
00:47:24,500 --> 00:47:22,320
their lives they're not slouches they're

1061
00:47:26,150 --> 00:47:24,510
not you know falling into the couch you

1062
00:47:29,050 --> 00:47:26,160
know eating pizza drinking beer and

1063
00:47:32,560 --> 00:47:29,060
watching television they're there

1064
00:47:36,400 --> 00:47:35,150
compassionate compassionate intelligent

1065
00:47:38,110 --> 00:47:36,410
active human beings

1066
00:47:41,260 --> 00:47:38,120
you know so that's one thing that

1067
00:47:42,970 --> 00:47:41,270
cannabis can do for some people is okay

1068
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:42,980
so one thing I didn't talk about with

1069
00:47:49,000 --> 00:47:46,850
the the pharmacokinetic function is that

1070
00:47:50,620 --> 00:47:49,010
it tends to balance on Bello talks a

1071
00:47:52,120 --> 00:47:50,630
little bit about this as well in the

1072
00:47:54,940 --> 00:47:52,130
book but also other people have talked

1073
00:47:58,140 --> 00:47:54,950
about it it tends to balance the blood

1074
00:48:00,760 --> 00:47:58,150
flow to both brain hemispheres and

1075
00:48:04,990 --> 00:48:00,770
generate a condition of homeostatic

1076
00:48:07,980 --> 00:48:05,000
balance dr. Robert Melamed calls it a

1077
00:48:11,350 --> 00:48:07,990
homeostatic regulator of cells and

1078
00:48:15,520 --> 00:48:11,360
society but that's another issue

1079
00:48:17,560 --> 00:48:15,530
and so it can just take the edge a

1080
00:48:18,790 --> 00:48:17,570
little off a little for some people if

1081
00:48:20,350 --> 00:48:18,800
they're using it right if they're using

1082
00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:20,360
it like you're not getting blasted right

1083
00:48:24,790 --> 00:48:22,370
we're talking about maybe having one or

1084
00:48:26,140 --> 00:48:24,800
two puffs early in the day and then they

1085
00:48:27,850 --> 00:48:26,150
go on about their day and then maybe

1086
00:48:32,500 --> 00:48:27,860
they have a top-up in the afternoon and

1087
00:48:33,970 --> 00:48:32,510
the evening I'm leery about I don't want

1088
00:48:36,070 --> 00:48:33,980
to encourage people to do that in

1089
00:48:37,270 --> 00:48:36,080
general because it's so easy to become

1090
00:48:39,790 --> 00:48:37,280
dependent what people would call

1091
00:48:41,650 --> 00:48:39,800
addicted to this plant because it's so

1092
00:48:43,510 --> 00:48:41,660
seductive and that's that's part of the

1093
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:43,520
kind of like almost what do you call it

1094
00:48:47,770 --> 00:48:46,130
almost like a catch-22 that you know you

1095
00:48:48,340 --> 00:48:47,780
might have these beautiful experiences

1096
00:48:50,920 --> 00:48:48,350
with it

1097
00:48:53,170 --> 00:48:50,930
I have frequent beautiful experiences

1098
00:48:54,820 --> 00:48:53,180
with this plant and you know who

1099
00:48:57,130 --> 00:48:54,830
wouldn't want to go back to a beautiful

1100
00:49:00,400 --> 00:48:57,140
experience you know it enhances your

1101
00:49:05,110 --> 00:49:00,410
appreciation of many things music you

1102
00:49:07,930 --> 00:49:05,120
know the munchies food you know visual

1103
00:49:09,250 --> 00:49:07,940
acuity is enhanced you know you look at

1104
00:49:11,410 --> 00:49:09,260
a painting and you go wow I never saw

1105
00:49:13,900 --> 00:49:11,420
the things in that painting that that

1106
00:49:16,420 --> 00:49:13,910
I'm seeing right now you know it can

1107
00:49:17,650 --> 00:49:16,430
induce great levels of appreciation and

1108
00:49:20,110 --> 00:49:17,660
that's why I wanted to mention the

1109
00:49:22,240 --> 00:49:20,120
biochemical function because you could

1110
00:49:24,610 --> 00:49:22,250
say that the the chemical reason for

1111
00:49:27,760 --> 00:49:24,620
that is that it opens up these channels

1112
00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:27,770
it sends a fresh oxygen oxygenated blood

1113
00:49:33,490 --> 00:49:31,130
throughout the system right so it is

1114
00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:33,500
very possible yeah so but it's very

1115
00:49:36,910 --> 00:49:35,450
possible to be seduced by that and want

1116
00:49:39,220 --> 00:49:36,920
to keep going back to it all the time

1117
00:49:41,140 --> 00:49:39,230
and that can have not only diminishing

1118
00:49:43,000 --> 00:49:41,150
returns but it can also lead to a

1119
00:49:45,520 --> 00:49:43,010
pattern of which you might call

1120
00:49:47,980 --> 00:49:45,530
addiction or dependence and that's not

1121
00:49:49,900 --> 00:49:47,990
necessarily healthy again I just want to

1122
00:49:52,420 --> 00:49:49,910
say though that some people

1123
00:49:54,910 --> 00:49:52,430
are able to manage that in a healthy way

1124
00:49:57,549 --> 00:49:54,920
daily on a daily basis and it just kind

1125
00:50:00,250 --> 00:49:57,559
of settles them down into a groove you

1126
00:50:01,870 --> 00:50:00,260
know and so that's up to individuals

1127
00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:01,880
it's the people's plant I just think

1128
00:50:06,579 --> 00:50:03,890
people should be aware that it's very

1129
00:50:09,849 --> 00:50:06,589
easy to get seduced especially it seems

1130
00:50:12,250 --> 00:50:09,859
younger people and you know adolescence

1131
00:50:15,010 --> 00:50:12,260
and early adults often times can get

1132
00:50:17,260 --> 00:50:15,020
seduced into into using it that way

1133
00:50:19,420 --> 00:50:17,270
Kathleen Harrison yeah I really

1134
00:50:21,490 --> 00:50:19,430
recommend people looking at her chapter

1135
00:50:23,890 --> 00:50:21,500
in the book because she's very clear on

1136
00:50:25,539 --> 00:50:23,900
that she's got about a page and a half

1137
00:50:28,089 --> 00:50:25,549
in her chapter where she talks about how

1138
00:50:30,670 --> 00:50:28,099
some people don't want to come back out

1139
00:50:32,620 --> 00:50:30,680
of that space into what she called the

1140
00:50:34,900 --> 00:50:32,630
daylight world of responsibilities and

1141
00:50:37,150 --> 00:50:34,910
relationship and they become more wedded

1142
00:50:39,039 --> 00:50:37,160
to the plant than they are wedded to

1143
00:50:41,289 --> 00:50:39,049
their relationships in their life that

1144
00:50:43,089 --> 00:50:41,299
can be a problem and it can be a chronic

1145
00:50:45,309 --> 00:50:43,099
problem some people you probably know

1146
00:50:53,380 --> 00:50:45,319
yourself have fallen into that pattern

1147
00:50:57,250 --> 00:50:53,390
yeah decades bigger than them you know

1148
00:50:59,019 --> 00:50:57,260
with any type of drug like cannabis and

1149
00:51:02,349 --> 00:50:59,029
that can become bigger than them and so

1150
00:51:04,420 --> 00:51:02,359
it doesn't have a reasonable space in

1151
00:51:07,630 --> 00:51:04,430
their lives it becomes just an

1152
00:51:11,140 --> 00:51:07,640
overwhelming is to rather that it has

1153
00:51:13,839 --> 00:51:11,150
its own space so yeah I mean this is a

1154
00:51:15,730 --> 00:51:13,849
wonderful explanation of how to go about

1155
00:51:18,130 --> 00:51:15,740
this of how to work with this

1156
00:51:20,440 --> 00:51:18,140
responsibly you know if you do know that

1157
00:51:22,990 --> 00:51:20,450
you have addiction problems this may not

1158
00:51:24,490 --> 00:51:23,000
be for you so you have to know something

1159
00:51:27,430 --> 00:51:24,500
about yourself when it comes to

1160
00:51:29,890 --> 00:51:27,440
substances and and you have to be

1161
00:51:32,799 --> 00:51:29,900
willing to say no this isn't for me and

1162
00:51:34,150 --> 00:51:32,809
and that's it if that is the truth so

1163
00:51:36,069 --> 00:51:34,160
you've got to find that truth about

1164
00:51:38,559 --> 00:51:36,079
yourself first before you take any steps

1165
00:51:39,789 --> 00:51:38,569
towards this whether it's legal or not I

1166
00:51:42,880 --> 00:51:39,799
mean you still have to know yourself

1167
00:51:45,910 --> 00:51:42,890
well enough to do this responsibly and

1168
00:51:47,650 --> 00:51:45,920
you did say that except we're gonna take

1169
00:51:49,720 --> 00:51:47,660
the medical stuff and put it aside and

1170
00:51:52,240 --> 00:51:49,730
just say if you're doing this for

1171
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:52,250
spiritual purposes the recommendation is

1172
00:51:56,740 --> 00:51:55,010
not to do this every day right yeah

1173
00:52:00,910 --> 00:51:56,750
again without being hard and fast about

1174
00:52:02,980 --> 00:52:00,920
it because if if I ask my friend that I

1175
00:52:03,880 --> 00:52:02,990
was referring to one person in

1176
00:52:08,140 --> 00:52:03,890
particular a female

1177
00:52:10,210 --> 00:52:08,150
months ago the way she uses it daily she

1178
00:52:12,849 --> 00:52:10,220
would probably disagree with me because

1179
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:12,859
she just she gets a lot done

1180
00:52:18,759 --> 00:52:16,010
she's an open-hearted person I don't I'm

1181
00:52:20,559 --> 00:52:18,769
not aware I could be naive in certain

1182
00:52:22,720 --> 00:52:20,569
situations but I'm not aware of any

1183
00:52:24,490 --> 00:52:22,730
downsides for her using it that way and

1184
00:52:25,900 --> 00:52:24,500
again but I want to be careful about

1185
00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:25,910
that with your listeners because that's

1186
00:52:30,819 --> 00:52:28,490
not necessarily the case for for for

1187
00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:30,829
everybody by any means this is a person

1188
00:52:34,870 --> 00:52:32,930
who's very active in life she's holding

1189
00:52:37,180 --> 00:52:34,880
down three jobs she's one of the

1190
00:52:39,910 --> 00:52:37,190
co-organizers of our conference she's a

1191
00:52:41,859 --> 00:52:39,920
she's a cannabis ceremony leader and she

1192
00:52:43,509 --> 00:52:41,869
also leads cacao ceremonies and she does

1193
00:52:45,849 --> 00:52:43,519
private work with people using other

1194
00:52:48,190 --> 00:52:45,859
psychedelics she's what you might call a

1195
00:52:50,349 --> 00:52:48,200
fairly well processed human being and

1196
00:52:52,660 --> 00:52:50,359
she knows how to use her medicines and

1197
00:52:55,599 --> 00:52:52,670
channel them so that's something again

1198
00:52:59,109 --> 00:52:55,609
another way of talking about effective

1199
00:53:02,259 --> 00:52:59,119
skillful use of cannabis is to talk

1200
00:53:08,440 --> 00:53:02,269
about channeling that amplified energy

1201
00:53:10,420 --> 00:53:08,450
right talking about more of this you've

1202
00:53:13,269 --> 00:53:10,430
got more questions from our chat room

1203
00:53:14,950 --> 00:53:13,279
participants thank you so much guys and

1204
00:53:16,990 --> 00:53:14,960
gals for sending those over we're going

1205
00:53:19,450 --> 00:53:17,000
to try to get to them in the next

1206
00:53:23,559 --> 00:53:19,460
segment and in the meantime we're gonna

1207
00:53:25,809 --> 00:53:23,569
take a short commercial break and we

1208
00:53:28,450 --> 00:53:25,819
will be right back this is supernatural

1209
00:53:30,279 --> 00:53:28,460
girls radio welcome back everyone to

1210
00:53:33,249 --> 00:53:30,289
supernatural Girls radio

1211
00:53:36,819 --> 00:53:33,259
I'm your host Patricia Baker here On

1212
00:53:40,089 --> 00:53:36,829
January 3rd 2018 I'm here with my

1213
00:53:42,279 --> 00:53:40,099
co-host Patricia Kirkman PK all the way

1214
00:53:44,710 --> 00:53:42,289
from sunny Tucson and we are so jealous

1215
00:53:49,480 --> 00:53:44,720
because it's in the 70s there while we

1216
00:53:51,789 --> 00:53:49,490
are in single digits in New England and

1217
00:53:55,089 --> 00:53:51,799
anyways we are talking to a great guest

1218
00:53:57,460 --> 00:53:55,099
tonight Steven gray is the author of a

1219
00:54:01,539 --> 00:53:57,470
new book cannabis and the spirituality

1220
00:54:04,690 --> 00:54:01,549
and we're learning yes all about how to

1221
00:54:08,410 --> 00:54:04,700
work with this plant this sacred plant

1222
00:54:12,160 --> 00:54:08,420
this sacrament to reached enlightenment

1223
00:54:14,440 --> 00:54:12,170
to take away the matrix that we've been

1224
00:54:16,509 --> 00:54:14,450
hooked into for however many years and

1225
00:54:17,530 --> 00:54:16,519
finally get some freedom here

1226
00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:17,540
so here's

1227
00:54:24,370 --> 00:54:21,890
question that came up for you Stephen

1228
00:54:26,590 --> 00:54:24,380
and it's from Rohan Lewis who's asking

1229
00:54:29,610 --> 00:54:26,600
hello Stephen can you please explain

1230
00:54:32,710 --> 00:54:29,620
what parts of the brain these

1231
00:54:36,070 --> 00:54:32,720
hallucinogens are opening up to connect

1232
00:54:37,930 --> 00:54:36,080
us to a spiritual connection okay well I

1233
00:54:40,030 --> 00:54:37,940
need to start with a disclaimer that I'm

1234
00:54:42,430 --> 00:54:40,040
not a scientist and I've only made a

1235
00:54:45,690 --> 00:54:42,440
cursory or casual study of that per se

1236
00:54:48,630 --> 00:54:45,700
first of all with cannabis we have

1237
00:54:51,610 --> 00:54:48,640
something in our bodies called the

1238
00:54:54,310 --> 00:54:51,620
endocannabinoid system endo meaning

1239
00:54:56,650 --> 00:54:54,320
interior or something like that okay its

1240
00:54:59,740 --> 00:54:56,660
extensive some researchers have said

1241
00:55:03,850 --> 00:54:59,750
it's the most prevalent receptor system

1242
00:55:07,120 --> 00:55:03,860
in the human organism cannabis itself is

1243
00:55:09,880 --> 00:55:07,130
an exogenous or EXO cannabis or

1244
00:55:12,430 --> 00:55:09,890
cannabinoid so it's taken into the body

1245
00:55:16,420 --> 00:55:12,440
and it meets these ready receptors right

1246
00:55:17,260 --> 00:55:16,430
so we're very our system is very

1247
00:55:20,830 --> 00:55:17,270
simpatico

1248
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:20,840
with cannabis it these ready receptors

1249
00:55:24,700 --> 00:55:22,850
are all over in the brain and the

1250
00:55:27,460 --> 00:55:24,710
nervous system and so on and so on

1251
00:55:29,910 --> 00:55:27,470
there's no toxicity to this plant there

1252
00:55:33,700 --> 00:55:29,920
there's there's a there's a term called

1253
00:55:36,940 --> 00:55:33,710
ld50 lethal dose 50 it's a medical term

1254
00:55:38,410 --> 00:55:36,950
and it means the dosage at which 50

1255
00:55:42,100 --> 00:55:38,420
percent of the people taking that

1256
00:55:44,980 --> 00:55:42,110
particular drug will die right alcohol

1257
00:55:47,050 --> 00:55:44,990
has a very definite ld50 of somewhere

1258
00:55:49,870 --> 00:55:47,060
around 32 ounces in a certain period of

1259
00:55:52,330 --> 00:55:49,880
time many people die from fern

1260
00:55:55,660 --> 00:55:52,340
pharmaceutical drugs taken legally just

1261
00:55:57,880 --> 00:55:55,670
be for that for the same reason yes yeah

1262
00:56:02,710 --> 00:55:57,890
Kanak cannabis to all intents and

1263
00:56:04,660 --> 00:56:02,720
purposes has no ld50 you it was pretty

1264
00:56:07,330 --> 00:56:04,670
much functionally or practically

1265
00:56:11,890 --> 00:56:07,340
impossible to do that kind of harm to

1266
00:56:14,830 --> 00:56:11,900
yourself as the folk great country

1267
00:56:16,840 --> 00:56:14,840
singer willie nelson once said that i'm

1268
00:56:19,120 --> 00:56:16,850
paraphrasing the only way you could ever

1269
00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:19,130
die from cannabis as if a heavy bale of

1270
00:56:26,710 --> 00:56:24,410
it fell off a truck and crushed you so

1271
00:56:29,500 --> 00:56:26,720
it's an extremely safe plant that is

1272
00:56:30,599 --> 00:56:29,510
very simpatico with the human organism

1273
00:56:33,329 --> 00:56:30,609
in that regard

1274
00:56:36,479 --> 00:56:33,339
okay now there's been some fascinating

1275
00:56:37,979 --> 00:56:36,489
research on the what's going on you know

1276
00:56:41,779 --> 00:56:37,989
that with all the brain imaging stuff

1277
00:56:44,430 --> 00:56:41,789
that they're able to do now with

1278
00:56:47,759 --> 00:56:44,440
psychedelics like psilocybin for example

1279
00:56:49,769 --> 00:56:47,769
and I find that stuff really exciting

1280
00:56:51,599 --> 00:56:49,779
one of the presenters at our conference

1281
00:56:53,120 --> 00:56:51,609
a couple years ago was a scientist who's

1282
00:56:55,549 --> 00:56:53,130
who was working in that area

1283
00:56:58,890 --> 00:56:55,559
neuroscience she's a neuroscientist and

1284
00:57:03,059 --> 00:56:58,900
she threw up pictures on the screen on

1285
00:57:04,680 --> 00:57:03,069
her PowerPoint of the brain with colored

1286
00:57:06,239 --> 00:57:04,690
lines showing the connections between

1287
00:57:09,390 --> 00:57:06,249
different parts of the brain and she

1288
00:57:11,489 --> 00:57:09,400
didn't have like one image you know of

1289
00:57:16,349 --> 00:57:11,499
the quote normal or sober brain and

1290
00:57:18,839 --> 00:57:16,359
beside it is the same brain in under the

1291
00:57:20,579 --> 00:57:18,849
influence of psilocybin and all these

1292
00:57:23,130 --> 00:57:20,589
connections happening to different parts

1293
00:57:26,309 --> 00:57:23,140
of the brain that weren't there before

1294
00:57:28,079 --> 00:57:26,319
so these substances like psilocybin

1295
00:57:30,839 --> 00:57:28,089
their trip called tryptamine

1296
00:57:32,549 --> 00:57:30,849
hallucinogens and hallucinogens is not

1297
00:57:36,420 --> 00:57:32,559
an appropriate word by the way but you

1298
00:57:36,749 --> 00:57:36,430
talk about that at another time excuse

1299
00:57:39,180 --> 00:57:36,759
me

1300
00:57:41,190 --> 00:57:39,190
because to lose a hallucination is

1301
00:57:48,049 --> 00:57:41,200
considered a pathological experience

1302
00:57:50,609 --> 00:57:48,059
that's not real right anyway substances

1303
00:57:54,809 --> 00:57:50,619
chemical configuration of psilocybin

1304
00:57:57,150 --> 00:57:54,819
matches brain chemistry very closely the

1305
00:57:59,599 --> 00:57:57,160
most powerful psychedelic on the on the

1306
00:58:01,979 --> 00:57:59,609
planet some people would maybe say

1307
00:58:04,529 --> 00:58:01,989
another one is slightly more so that's

1308
00:58:07,950 --> 00:58:04,539
five Meo DMT but DMT or

1309
00:58:11,450 --> 00:58:07,960
dimethyltryptamine is considered the

1310
00:58:15,420 --> 00:58:11,460
most powerful psychedelic on the planet

1311
00:58:17,729 --> 00:58:15,430
and it we have it in our brain chemistry

1312
00:58:20,549 --> 00:58:17,739
it exists in the pineal gland I believe

1313
00:58:23,279 --> 00:58:20,559
it's pronounced pineal pind ALS right

1314
00:58:25,400 --> 00:58:23,289
yeah and and dr. Rick Strassman wrote a

1315
00:58:28,289 --> 00:58:25,410
book called this DMT the spirit not a

1316
00:58:30,779 --> 00:58:28,299
molecule where he speculated not

1317
00:58:34,819 --> 00:58:30,789
claiming you know for sure but saying

1318
00:58:39,180 --> 00:58:34,829
that it's very possible that an increase

1319
00:58:41,220 --> 00:58:39,190
of DMT in the pineal gland released into

1320
00:58:43,650 --> 00:58:41,230
one of the two brain brain hemispheres

1321
00:58:46,050 --> 00:58:43,660
is responsible for

1322
00:58:49,010 --> 00:58:46,060
experiences of mystical awakening like

1323
00:58:52,790 --> 00:58:49,020
Satori or whatever you want to call it

1324
00:58:57,450 --> 00:58:52,800
yeah so so these these substances like

1325
00:59:00,750 --> 00:58:57,460
psilocybin mushrooms ayahuasca peyote

1326
00:59:03,090 --> 00:59:00,760
they're very simpatico with with brain

1327
00:59:06,240 --> 00:59:03,100
chemistry they don't leave you you know

1328
00:59:08,370 --> 00:59:06,250
like for example datura is not in that

1329
00:59:12,050 --> 00:59:08,380
category the Torah can leave you rubber

1330
00:59:18,210 --> 00:59:15,600
and and many pharmaceutical drugs are

1331
00:59:20,570 --> 00:59:18,220
not really in that sense simpatico with

1332
00:59:24,570 --> 00:59:20,580
brain chemistry in that natural way so

1333
00:59:26,370 --> 00:59:24,580
in terms of this person's question these

1334
00:59:29,310 --> 00:59:26,380
plants are not really not foreign to our

1335
00:59:32,370 --> 00:59:29,320
brains I would say overall they're they

1336
00:59:34,770 --> 00:59:32,380
are safe it's rare that there would ever

1337
00:59:37,230 --> 00:59:34,780
be I mean you'd have to take a boatload

1338
00:59:39,450 --> 00:59:37,240
of peyote to I mean you could get

1339
00:59:40,800 --> 00:59:39,460
certainly be throwing up like crazy if

1340
00:59:43,860 --> 00:59:40,810
you take a lot of it you know if you're

1341
00:59:46,500 --> 00:59:43,870
not used to it ayahuasca may have an

1342
00:59:48,150 --> 00:59:46,510
ld50 at some point it but it's far far

1343
00:59:51,810 --> 00:59:48,160
beyond the amount that anyone could

1344
00:59:54,030 --> 00:59:51,820
handle you know emotionally or whatever

1345
00:59:55,860 --> 00:59:54,040
you want to call that yeah yeah it's

1346
00:59:57,930 --> 00:59:55,870
it's all fascinating and it's so

1347
01:00:01,680 --> 00:59:57,940
interesting that all of this is coming

1348
01:00:03,120 --> 01:00:01,690
to the forefront now as we're moving

1349
01:00:06,150 --> 01:00:03,130
towards let's hope a more enlightened

1350
01:00:08,730 --> 01:00:06,160
planet but also let's talk a little bit

1351
01:00:12,630 --> 01:00:08,740
about the fact that that cannabis has

1352
01:00:16,260 --> 01:00:12,640
been identified as a feminine aspect as

1353
01:00:18,540 --> 01:00:16,270
a feminine spirit and I think that's so

1354
01:00:21,030 --> 01:00:18,550
interesting and you brought it up this

1355
01:00:24,990 --> 01:00:21,040
it's mentioned a few places in the book

1356
01:00:28,560 --> 01:00:25,000
and I think it it is a metaphor also in

1357
01:00:33,510 --> 01:00:28,570
the in the way that the feminine spirit

1358
01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:33,520
has been restricted it has been treated

1359
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:36,010
in a way that it needs to be controlled

1360
01:00:42,180 --> 01:00:39,010
and certainly cannabis has been treated

1361
01:00:45,000 --> 01:00:42,190
that way up until recently in the United

1362
01:00:47,490 --> 01:00:45,010
States not in other places but there is

1363
01:00:49,320 --> 01:00:47,500
something going on here where now

1364
01:00:53,640 --> 01:00:49,330
cannabis is becoming more available

1365
01:00:57,660 --> 01:00:53,650
you're teaching people how to perceive

1366
01:01:01,020 --> 01:00:57,670
it as a sacrament as a spiritual

1367
01:01:02,970 --> 01:01:01,030
a lie and and that's a very different

1368
01:01:05,460 --> 01:01:02,980
perspective than what is what we've been

1369
01:01:07,920 --> 01:01:05,470
taught about cannabis being such a

1370
01:01:10,829 --> 01:01:07,930
horrible plan being such a dangerous

1371
01:01:13,410 --> 01:01:10,839
thing so we're getting out of that whole

1372
01:01:16,410 --> 01:01:13,420
mindset but I just love the fact that

1373
01:01:19,859 --> 01:01:16,420
this is a feminine spirit Ally I think

1374
01:01:22,440 --> 01:01:19,869
it's very very interesting and does that

1375
01:01:24,569 --> 01:01:22,450
mean also Steven that it would ask you

1376
01:01:27,120 --> 01:01:24,579
set your intent for spiritual awakening

1377
01:01:30,809 --> 01:01:27,130
it's also going to help you awaken that

1378
01:01:34,650 --> 01:01:30,819
feminine principle within yourself yeah

1379
01:01:38,039 --> 01:01:34,660
I would say so I I just if I may just

1380
01:01:39,690 --> 01:01:38,049
interject real briefly a comment that

1381
01:01:41,760 --> 01:01:39,700
might be useful for people to understand

1382
01:01:44,789 --> 01:01:41,770
the concept of drug because it's such a

1383
01:01:46,200 --> 01:01:44,799
you know a bandied about word I really

1384
01:01:48,809 --> 01:01:46,210
like the way Terence Mckenna

1385
01:01:51,030 --> 01:01:48,819
talked about that he said a drug is

1386
01:01:53,490 --> 01:01:51,040
anything that promotes unexamined

1387
01:01:55,910 --> 01:01:53,500
habitual behavior so that can be just

1388
01:01:57,089 --> 01:01:55,920
about anything I can be television

1389
01:02:01,079 --> 01:01:57,099
masturbating

1390
01:02:03,480 --> 01:02:01,089
you know workaholism you know video game

1391
01:02:05,640 --> 01:02:03,490
playing or a substance of any kind and

1392
01:02:08,910 --> 01:02:05,650
in cannabis can also be used in in that

1393
01:02:11,549 --> 01:02:08,920
way as well so but these psychedelics

1394
01:02:14,130 --> 01:02:11,559
these entheogenic substances entheogen

1395
01:02:15,630 --> 01:02:14,140
by the way means generating the divine

1396
01:02:17,760 --> 01:02:15,640
within and that's one of the reasons

1397
01:02:20,039 --> 01:02:17,770
that a lot of people prefer that term

1398
01:02:21,660 --> 01:02:20,049
now to psychedelic although that's a

1399
01:02:25,829 --> 01:02:21,670
good word to it just means mind

1400
01:02:27,420 --> 01:02:25,839
manifesting or soul manifesting so I

1401
01:02:29,069 --> 01:02:27,430
just want to say that that's an

1402
01:02:31,250 --> 01:02:29,079
important way to think about these

1403
01:02:34,349 --> 01:02:31,260
substances is that to think of them as

1404
01:02:37,410 --> 01:02:34,359
spiritual allies if used properly rather

1405
01:02:40,500 --> 01:02:37,420
than drugs and then and and not just

1406
01:02:42,839 --> 01:02:40,510
cannabis in regard to your question but

1407
01:02:46,079 --> 01:02:42,849
I talked earlier in our conversation

1408
01:02:49,770 --> 01:02:46,089
about the the softening effect you know

1409
01:02:55,140 --> 01:02:49,780
it's like oh boy how to talk about this

1410
01:02:57,780 --> 01:02:55,150
briefly I here's one this is just a way

1411
01:03:00,870 --> 01:02:57,790
of looking at things okay you might say

1412
01:03:05,460 --> 01:03:00,880
you might say that we're all children of

1413
01:03:08,130 --> 01:03:05,470
God and then in a sense this we came to

1414
01:03:10,079 --> 01:03:08,140
this planet with that potential but that

1415
01:03:11,010 --> 01:03:10,089
both in our individual lives but also

1416
01:03:13,800 --> 01:03:11,020
over the course

1417
01:03:16,170 --> 01:03:13,810
history the species became increasingly

1418
01:03:18,810 --> 01:03:16,180
cut off from our true unconditioned

1419
01:03:21,090 --> 01:03:18,820
nature and more and more identified with

1420
01:03:23,400 --> 01:03:21,100
the conditional ego that's always

1421
01:03:26,070 --> 01:03:23,410
thinking of you know its own survival

1422
01:03:28,920 --> 01:03:26,080
and all this kind of thing so survival

1423
01:03:32,370 --> 01:03:28,930
becomes the the dominant way of you know

1424
01:03:34,710 --> 01:03:32,380
dealing with life and that leads to you

1425
01:03:36,360 --> 01:03:34,720
know hierarchies and power fights and

1426
01:03:39,960 --> 01:03:36,370
all that so it becomes about power and

1427
01:03:43,230 --> 01:03:39,970
men had the power for one reason because

1428
01:03:45,750 --> 01:03:43,240
they were bigger and stronger right and

1429
01:03:47,910 --> 01:03:45,760
they were tied they weren't tied down by

1430
01:03:50,130 --> 01:03:47,920
the childbirth element of things in the

1431
01:03:53,310 --> 01:03:50,140
same way that women were so for whatever

1432
01:03:55,200 --> 01:03:53,320
reason men came to dominate most

1433
01:03:57,000 --> 01:03:55,210
cultures but not all which is an

1434
01:04:00,000 --> 01:03:57,010
interesting point in itself there are

1435
01:04:02,640 --> 01:04:00,010
matrilineal and matriarchal cultures as

1436
01:04:04,320 --> 01:04:02,650
well and there are partnership cultures

1437
01:04:06,330 --> 01:04:04,330
where there's been great respect for

1438
01:04:08,130 --> 01:04:06,340
women in that regard and where things

1439
01:04:10,410 --> 01:04:08,140
just take their natural place you know

1440
01:04:12,720 --> 01:04:10,420
it makes sense that a woman would be

1441
01:04:14,040 --> 01:04:12,730
around the hearth more because she's you

1442
01:04:15,600 --> 01:04:14,050
know she's the one connected to the

1443
01:04:18,380 --> 01:04:15,610
children she can breastfeed them when

1444
01:04:21,300 --> 01:04:18,390
they're young etcetera etc etc right so

1445
01:04:23,760 --> 01:04:21,310
but in but in this power dynamic thing I

1446
01:04:26,340 --> 01:04:23,770
mentioned earlier you know talking about

1447
01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:26,350
the nature of spiritual awakening so the

1448
01:04:30,600 --> 01:04:28,090
opposite of spiritual awakening in a

1449
01:04:32,940 --> 01:04:30,610
sense is ego which is this you know

1450
01:04:34,560 --> 01:04:32,950
tight package of survival and the

1451
01:04:36,750 --> 01:04:34,570
stories that we tell ourselves and all

1452
01:04:39,510 --> 01:04:36,760
that and it and there's a lot to do with

1453
01:04:42,060 --> 01:04:39,520
power and all that and so men have

1454
01:04:45,210 --> 01:04:42,070
managed to you know you know have that

1455
01:04:46,890 --> 01:04:45,220
power historically for the most part and

1456
01:04:49,440 --> 01:04:46,900
it involves a tightening and a

1457
01:04:52,770 --> 01:04:49,450
restricting and a toughening in a sense

1458
01:04:54,960 --> 01:04:52,780
right and close closing off energies

1459
01:04:57,450 --> 01:04:54,970
closing off of the our connection to

1460
01:04:59,970 --> 01:04:57,460
spirituality so those qualities have

1461
01:05:03,470 --> 01:04:59,980
been associated more with women and with

1462
01:05:07,080 --> 01:05:03,480
the feminine principle altogether so

1463
01:05:09,270 --> 01:05:07,090
again what cannabis can do when you are

1464
01:05:14,640 --> 01:05:09,280
able to channel that energy is release

1465
01:05:17,730 --> 01:05:14,650
that tight bounded quality and open us

1466
01:05:19,500 --> 01:05:17,740
up to the more heartfelt in a sense

1467
01:05:22,410 --> 01:05:19,510
nurturing it's like you could nurture

1468
01:05:24,570 --> 01:05:22,420
the planet almost you know or feel our

1469
01:05:26,730 --> 01:05:24,580
hearts not afraid to be vulnerable you

1470
01:05:30,120 --> 01:05:26,740
not afraid to be emotional you know

1471
01:05:31,500 --> 01:05:30,130
isn't it interesting how women cry far

1472
01:05:33,960 --> 01:05:31,510
more easily than men

1473
01:05:36,240 --> 01:05:33,970
you know why is that you know yeah and

1474
01:05:39,720 --> 01:05:36,250
it's and it's okay I mean very few

1475
01:05:41,550 --> 01:05:39,730
people are going to you know feel that

1476
01:05:44,190 --> 01:05:41,560
there's a problem if some if a woman

1477
01:05:45,900 --> 01:05:44,200
cries but a lot of men feel they can't

1478
01:05:49,770 --> 01:05:45,910
or they might feel that other men around

1479
01:05:54,480 --> 01:05:49,780
them crying are weak right you know yes

1480
01:05:59,210 --> 01:05:54,490
yeah yeah so so the feminizing I think

1481
01:06:02,220 --> 01:05:59,220
aspect is that there have been qualities

1482
01:06:04,140 --> 01:06:02,230
that are natural to all human beings

1483
01:06:07,400 --> 01:06:04,150
that have been repressed and there's

1484
01:06:10,530 --> 01:06:07,410
been a predominance toward this yang

1485
01:06:12,600 --> 01:06:10,540
male kind of energies in a sense right

1486
01:06:15,180 --> 01:06:12,610
but they're the same energies that are

1487
01:06:17,040 --> 01:06:15,190
that have cut us off from our

1488
01:06:19,380 --> 01:06:17,050
relationship to spirit into the world

1489
01:06:21,930 --> 01:06:19,390
into the into the planet altogether and

1490
01:06:24,510 --> 01:06:21,940
have led us to a crisis point in human

1491
01:06:27,720 --> 01:06:24,520
history now right so what we what needs

1492
01:06:30,750 --> 01:06:27,730
to happen arguably is that there needs

1493
01:06:33,540 --> 01:06:30,760
to be a rebalancing of the energies of

1494
01:06:35,550 --> 01:06:33,550
yin and yang of male and female and on

1495
01:06:37,320 --> 01:06:35,560
allowing of that softness that

1496
01:06:39,480 --> 01:06:37,330
open-heartedness you know that

1497
01:06:42,060 --> 01:06:39,490
gentleness that tenderness that

1498
01:06:45,270 --> 01:06:42,070
sensitivity that connectedness you know

1499
01:06:47,400 --> 01:06:45,280
that women often have more than men

1500
01:06:49,140 --> 01:06:47,410
because they've been allowed to in a

1501
01:07:04,260 --> 01:06:49,150
sense oh yeah it's just you know that's

1502
01:07:06,330 --> 01:07:04,270
a woman you know so this may give people

1503
01:07:08,610 --> 01:07:06,340
an opportunity as you mentioned to

1504
01:07:11,070 --> 01:07:08,620
balance both male and female within and

1505
01:07:15,150 --> 01:07:11,080
isn't that the big alchemical treatise

1506
01:07:18,300 --> 01:07:15,160
that we're all facing and face it

1507
01:07:20,520 --> 01:07:18,310
because they'll be stuck on in a in a

1508
01:07:22,290 --> 01:07:20,530
place of total ego but the people who

1509
01:07:23,970 --> 01:07:22,300
are looking for the spiritual awakening

1510
01:07:27,630 --> 01:07:23,980
can definitely work responsibly with

1511
01:07:29,310 --> 01:07:27,640
cannabis and have a good outcome now one

1512
01:07:31,800 --> 01:07:29,320
of the thing that you and I talked about

1513
01:07:34,460 --> 01:07:31,810
before is because I've heard this

1514
01:07:36,840 --> 01:07:34,470
complaint I'm a dream therapist and

1515
01:07:38,790 --> 01:07:36,850
people have said you know I have I'm

1516
01:07:41,820 --> 01:07:38,800
using this for my

1517
01:07:45,420 --> 01:07:41,830
pain or whatever but when I do I cannot

1518
01:07:51,090 --> 01:07:45,430
remember my dreams and so you had a good

1519
01:07:54,360 --> 01:07:51,100
a good answer for that I remember the

1520
01:07:55,770 --> 01:07:54,370
conversation yeah well you know part of

1521
01:07:57,390 --> 01:07:55,780
it is this what we talked about earlier

1522
01:07:59,190 --> 01:07:57,400
in the conversation this notion of

1523
01:08:02,700 --> 01:07:59,200
frequency of use being an important

1524
01:08:04,320 --> 01:08:02,710
issue there are other issues that not to

1525
01:08:06,390 --> 01:08:04,330
distract you from your question but that

1526
01:08:08,100 --> 01:08:06,400
if we have time and I don't think we

1527
01:08:09,660 --> 01:08:08,110
have much left now but maybe that's why

1528
01:08:11,520 --> 01:08:09,670
we need to do another win in a couple of

1529
01:08:13,980 --> 01:08:11,530
months we've never got into talking

1530
01:08:17,370 --> 01:08:13,990
about issues like dosage and methods of

1531
01:08:20,220 --> 01:08:17,380
intake and and those are important

1532
01:08:22,349 --> 01:08:20,230
issues and also ceremonial use and a few

1533
01:08:31,500 --> 01:08:22,359
other things that we didn't get into but

1534
01:08:34,320 --> 01:08:31,510
in regard to sorry I forgot about going

1535
01:08:36,780 --> 01:08:34,330
back to your comment about not using it

1536
01:08:41,010 --> 01:08:36,790
too frequently if you use it too

1537
01:08:44,250 --> 01:08:41,020
frequently you're going to yes the

1538
01:08:48,630 --> 01:08:44,260
dreams question sorry excuse me and I

1539
01:08:51,690 --> 01:08:48,640
haven't taken any canvas I can't blame I

1540
01:08:56,550 --> 01:08:51,700
can't blame my short-term memory loss on

1541
01:08:58,320 --> 01:08:56,560
that one yeah so all I know is anecdotal

1542
01:09:00,030 --> 01:08:58,330
evidence that a lot of people say that

1543
01:09:05,400 --> 01:09:00,040
when they smoke cannabis daily

1544
01:09:06,720 --> 01:09:05,410
they don't dream so so if you know if

1545
01:09:09,180 --> 01:09:06,730
you're having to use it for medicinal

1546
01:09:11,490 --> 01:09:09,190
benefit then are you just going to have

1547
01:09:14,250 --> 01:09:11,500
to live with that I guess for the most

1548
01:09:17,430 --> 01:09:14,260
part because you may need to use it

1549
01:09:19,829 --> 01:09:17,440
daily use cannabis daily if you don't

1550
01:09:24,240 --> 01:09:19,839
need to use it daily and you would like

1551
01:09:26,010 --> 01:09:24,250
to understand and practice how to use it

1552
01:09:27,870 --> 01:09:26,020
as a spiritual ally or spiritual

1553
01:09:30,900 --> 01:09:27,880
medicine again

1554
01:09:33,270 --> 01:09:30,910
a number of people such as some of the

1555
01:09:35,490 --> 01:09:33,280
contributors to the book say that less

1556
01:09:37,440 --> 01:09:35,500
frequently is going to be more effective

1557
01:09:40,530 --> 01:09:37,450
one of the contributors to the book

1558
01:09:43,260 --> 01:09:40,540
mariano da silva is a both an ayahuasca

1559
01:09:46,050 --> 01:09:43,270
shaman and a cannabis shaman or expert

1560
01:09:50,640 --> 01:09:46,060
on it as a spiritual medicine and he

1561
01:09:52,709 --> 01:09:50,650
says that said that he tries to keep it

1562
01:09:54,750 --> 01:09:52,719
down to like once a week

1563
01:09:56,370 --> 01:09:54,760
you know leave five six seven days

1564
01:09:58,200 --> 01:09:56,380
between times and then it's going to be

1565
01:10:00,959 --> 01:09:58,210
sharper and deeper when you channel that

1566
01:10:03,180 --> 01:10:00,969
energy and then you know you bring some

1567
01:10:08,129 --> 01:10:03,190
kind of meditative focus into it as much

1568
01:10:10,529 --> 01:10:08,139
as possible so yeah that that there's I

1569
01:10:14,250 --> 01:10:10,539
would guess that if you are able to

1570
01:10:17,310 --> 01:10:14,260
limit your frequency of use to you know

1571
01:10:20,549 --> 01:10:17,320
sort of every four or five six day seven

1572
01:10:24,359 --> 01:10:20,559
days then you're more likely to have the

1573
01:10:26,459 --> 01:10:24,369
dreams come back in our conversation

1574
01:10:28,950 --> 01:10:26,469
about that I mentioned this substance

1575
01:10:30,209 --> 01:10:28,960
that somebody gave me recently it's

1576
01:10:32,850 --> 01:10:30,219
happened to be sitting here I've been

1577
01:10:35,279 --> 01:10:32,860
using it actually yeah it's called

1578
01:10:37,439 --> 01:10:35,289
dreams tea and it has damiana mugwort

1579
01:10:40,109 --> 01:10:37,449
blue and pink Lotus passion flower

1580
01:10:44,279 --> 01:10:40,119
lavender and spearmint in it I've now

1581
01:10:46,500 --> 01:10:44,289
taken it I've now taken had a cup of

1582
01:10:48,870 --> 01:10:46,510
this stuff about an hour before bedtime

1583
01:10:51,299 --> 01:10:48,880
four times I've only had it for about a

1584
01:10:54,290 --> 01:10:51,309
week and a half and three of the four

1585
01:10:58,350 --> 01:10:54,300
times I definitely had more powerful

1586
01:11:01,109 --> 01:10:58,360
meaningful lively or more visual dreams

1587
01:11:03,379 --> 01:11:01,119
than I've been having in recent years so

1588
01:11:06,060 --> 01:11:03,389
maybe there are certain kinds of herbal

1589
01:11:14,189 --> 01:11:06,070
herbs that you know people can take that

1590
01:11:15,629 --> 01:11:14,199
might counteract that I was also

1591
01:11:17,189 --> 01:11:15,639
thinking about the fact you're talking

1592
01:11:19,410 --> 01:11:17,199
about the sensitivity inhale it brings

1593
01:11:21,299 --> 01:11:19,420
us out with everybody we are in a

1594
01:11:23,969 --> 01:11:21,309
universal two-year which deals with

1595
01:11:26,700 --> 01:11:23,979
sensitivity so people involved with the

1596
01:11:28,620 --> 01:11:26,710
cannabis or taking it will they find it

1597
01:11:30,120 --> 01:11:28,630
maybe need less of it this year because

1598
01:11:32,819 --> 01:11:30,130
the year itself makes them more

1599
01:11:35,819 --> 01:11:32,829
sensitive so the intake may be more

1600
01:11:37,620 --> 01:11:35,829
potent well you know that's an

1601
01:11:38,939 --> 01:11:37,630
interesting question about dosage then

1602
01:11:41,219 --> 01:11:38,949
I'll don't give me an excuse to talk

1603
01:11:42,719 --> 01:11:41,229
about that for a minute one of the one

1604
01:11:44,160 --> 01:11:42,729
of the themes that comes up in the book

1605
01:11:48,509 --> 01:11:44,170
repeatedly from different contributors

1606
01:11:51,359 --> 01:11:48,519
is this notion that less is more no less

1607
01:11:54,209 --> 01:11:51,369
isn't always more and sometimes more is

1608
01:11:56,700 --> 01:11:54,219
more too but it's not about getting

1609
01:11:59,160 --> 01:11:56,710
blasted it's not about escaping in any

1610
01:12:00,930 --> 01:11:59,170
way and it's not necessarily about

1611
01:12:03,509 --> 01:12:00,940
creating some sort of sensational

1612
01:12:05,250 --> 01:12:03,519
experience it's about and Joan Bello

1613
01:12:06,180 --> 01:12:05,260
talks about this really well in her

1614
01:12:08,760 --> 01:12:06,190
chapter

1615
01:12:10,680 --> 01:12:08,770
it's about retraining ourselves overtime

1616
01:12:12,510 --> 01:12:10,690
because of course the experience fades

1617
01:12:15,270 --> 01:12:12,520
in a couple of hours right you know you

1618
01:12:15,689 --> 01:12:15,280
might have it but you're back to base

1619
01:12:18,660 --> 01:12:15,699
camp

1620
01:12:23,340 --> 01:12:18,670
two hours later or whatever so it's

1621
01:12:25,640 --> 01:12:23,350
really about recognizing that space

1622
01:12:28,080 --> 01:12:25,650
having these experiences occasionally

1623
01:12:32,390 --> 01:12:28,090
relaxing into it and recognizing that

1624
01:12:34,709 --> 01:12:32,400
our natural way is to trust the

1625
01:12:36,689 --> 01:12:34,719
free-flowing movement of energy so to

1626
01:12:41,010 --> 01:12:36,699
speak as I understand it that's what the

1627
01:12:43,050 --> 01:12:41,020
Dow ta w ta o the Dow means it's

1628
01:12:45,450 --> 01:12:43,060
sometimes called the watercourse way

1629
01:12:47,820 --> 01:12:45,460
like the way one water will always find

1630
01:12:50,220 --> 01:12:47,830
the most effortless effective way to

1631
01:12:52,229 --> 01:12:50,230
make its way down a mountain that's a

1632
01:12:55,340 --> 01:12:52,239
kind of a metaphor for how we can

1633
01:12:57,660 --> 01:12:55,350
function by trusting our own

1634
01:12:59,520 --> 01:12:57,670
unconditioned intelligence in the moment

1635
01:13:01,860 --> 01:12:59,530
and that requires us to get out of our

1636
01:13:05,870 --> 01:13:01,870
heads to a large degree it just relax

1637
01:13:09,420 --> 01:13:05,880
into it but in terms of this notion of

1638
01:13:11,459 --> 01:13:09,430
less is more you don't have to have a

1639
01:13:12,810 --> 01:13:11,469
lot of cannabis to do that and

1640
01:13:13,950 --> 01:13:12,820
especially if you're dealing with the

1641
01:13:15,660 --> 01:13:13,960
you know the way we're dealing with

1642
01:13:17,850 --> 01:13:15,670
these super strong

1643
01:13:20,370 --> 01:13:17,860
you know medicines these cannabis

1644
01:13:22,470 --> 01:13:20,380
medicines these days a very light dose

1645
01:13:24,870 --> 01:13:22,480
is a good place to start especially if

1646
01:13:26,700 --> 01:13:24,880
you're you want to find out how much you

1647
01:13:28,650 --> 01:13:26,710
can stay relaxed and present with

1648
01:13:30,780 --> 01:13:28,660
because the the bit the higher the

1649
01:13:32,370 --> 01:13:30,790
dosage the more the ego is potentially

1650
01:13:35,220 --> 01:13:32,380
threatened and the more you're gonna

1651
01:13:36,689 --> 01:13:35,230
your ego is going to kick up the dust as

1652
01:13:38,520 --> 01:13:36,699
it were and try to prevent that from

1653
01:13:41,010 --> 01:13:38,530
happening so your mind can get really

1654
01:13:44,100 --> 01:13:41,020
busy you can have physical symptoms like

1655
01:13:46,380 --> 01:13:44,110
dizziness nausea etc you can have panic

1656
01:13:48,959 --> 01:13:46,390
attacks paranoia can be associated with

1657
01:13:50,970 --> 01:13:48,969
that all those things are related to our

1658
01:13:54,120 --> 01:13:50,980
ego being threatened in a sense but

1659
01:13:55,800 --> 01:13:54,130
that's where our path lies too so you

1660
01:13:58,290 --> 01:13:55,810
know dosage start with a very small

1661
01:14:01,530 --> 01:13:58,300
dosage especially if you're not familiar

1662
01:14:03,270 --> 01:14:01,540
with it and again if you're doing it

1663
01:14:04,800 --> 01:14:03,280
every day it's different because there's

1664
01:14:06,780 --> 01:14:04,810
a tolerance effect but if you're doing

1665
01:14:08,550 --> 01:14:06,790
it in these kinds of ways perhaps you

1666
01:14:12,420 --> 01:14:08,560
know once every four days or once a week

1667
01:14:15,000 --> 01:14:12,430
or even less often then start with very

1668
01:14:16,950 --> 01:14:15,010
small dose try to be present with it see

1669
01:14:18,410 --> 01:14:16,960
if you can relax out of your head to

1670
01:14:21,650 --> 01:14:18,420
some degree and then

1671
01:14:24,230 --> 01:14:21,660
then maybe try to up the dosage in that

1672
01:14:28,580 --> 01:14:24,240
regard so thanks for allowing me to

1673
01:14:30,980 --> 01:14:28,590
segue into that one question that needed

1674
01:14:32,450 --> 01:14:30,990
to be answered and I'm glad PK asked you

1675
01:14:35,030 --> 01:14:32,460
that question you were able to bring it

1676
01:14:36,440 --> 01:14:35,040
to this because that is always a very

1677
01:14:39,110 --> 01:14:36,450
important question has to be answered

1678
01:14:41,990 --> 01:14:39,120
how much do you take and also then you

1679
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:42,000
can go further with what kind of method

1680
01:14:46,250 --> 01:14:44,010
you use because there's so many methods

1681
01:14:49,300 --> 01:14:46,260
of administering this whether it's a

1682
01:14:51,200 --> 01:14:49,310
chocolate candy bar a lozenge ur

1683
01:14:55,460 --> 01:14:51,210
suppository I mean they have all

1684
01:14:57,620 --> 01:14:55,470
different cards it's like how do you you

1685
01:14:59,720 --> 01:14:57,630
know how do you decide but I guess again

1686
01:15:01,970 --> 01:14:59,730
everybody's different you need to use

1687
01:15:05,630 --> 01:15:01,980
what you're comfortable with but I love

1688
01:15:08,270 --> 01:15:05,640
your advice Stephen G be cautious and to

1689
01:15:13,370 --> 01:15:08,280
start small it's also I would imagine

1690
01:15:15,410 --> 01:15:13,380
less expensive to start and also in

1691
01:15:17,420 --> 01:15:15,420
regard to what PK was saying about you

1692
01:15:19,010 --> 01:15:17,430
know maybe the the veils are thinner

1693
01:15:20,870 --> 01:15:19,020
this year is one way of putting it

1694
01:15:23,180 --> 01:15:20,880
perhaps I think that could be true as

1695
01:15:24,920 --> 01:15:23,190
well you know and fit into this

1696
01:15:27,260 --> 01:15:24,930
less-is-more notion because ultimately

1697
01:15:29,390 --> 01:15:27,270
you know what Buddhists and other great

1698
01:15:31,880 --> 01:15:29,400
traditions would say is this the wakin

1699
01:15:36,070 --> 01:15:31,890
state is our natural state we don't

1700
01:15:39,080 --> 01:15:36,080
necessarily have to have you know

1701
01:15:41,000 --> 01:15:39,090
substances to help us that regard that's

1702
01:15:44,000 --> 01:15:41,010
just that they do tend to open channels

1703
01:15:45,680 --> 01:15:44,010
up that had been shut down but the more

1704
01:15:48,020 --> 01:15:45,690
you pay attention in fact with ayahuasca

1705
01:15:50,300 --> 01:15:48,030
the the ayahuasca rose the shamans that

1706
01:15:52,940 --> 01:15:50,310
have been using this substance for many

1707
01:15:54,440 --> 01:15:52,950
many years say they many of them gotten

1708
01:15:59,720 --> 01:15:54,450
to the point where they hardly need any

1709
01:16:01,880 --> 01:15:59,730
of it to have a stable experience you

1710
01:16:06,020 --> 01:16:01,890
and in fact let me just finish off by

1711
01:16:08,480 --> 01:16:06,030
saying this if you there's an there's

1712
01:16:12,470 --> 01:16:08,490
indigenous people often have this notion

1713
01:16:14,960 --> 01:16:12,480
that a plant can become medicine for you

1714
01:16:16,370 --> 01:16:14,970
and it when it what they mean as I

1715
01:16:19,160 --> 01:16:16,380
understand it is that when you've

1716
01:16:21,620 --> 01:16:19,170
developed a relationship with that plant

1717
01:16:23,330 --> 01:16:21,630
and I think ultimately the spirit of

1718
01:16:25,700 --> 01:16:23,340
that plant or what cat Harrison would

1719
01:16:27,350 --> 01:16:25,710
call the mother of that plant then you

1720
01:16:29,660 --> 01:16:27,360
actually have a relationship with the

1721
01:16:32,000 --> 01:16:29,670
plant that doesn't necessarily require

1722
01:16:34,220 --> 01:16:32,010
you to take it

1723
01:16:36,770 --> 01:16:34,230
to smoke it or eat it you know in the

1724
01:16:38,600 --> 01:16:36,780
native appearance ceremonies they

1725
01:16:40,520 --> 01:16:38,610
sometimes couldn't get the medicine they

1726
01:16:42,260 --> 01:16:40,530
have one peyote plant called the chief

1727
01:16:45,080 --> 01:16:42,270
peyote and occasionally they would have

1728
01:16:46,580 --> 01:16:45,090
to just pass it around and everyone they

1729
01:16:48,740 --> 01:16:46,590
would have a very powerful experience

1730
01:16:52,840 --> 01:16:48,750
sometimes and I can see that we need to

1731
01:16:55,070 --> 01:16:52,850
quit now right yeah unfortunately we do

1732
01:16:56,420 --> 01:16:55,080
we're gonna have to have you back just

1733
01:16:58,910 --> 01:16:56,430
again you have so much great information

1734
01:17:00,830 --> 01:16:58,920
for everybody a wonderful book that

1735
01:17:02,900 --> 01:17:00,840
everybody should definitely get on

1736
01:17:05,840 --> 01:17:02,910
amazon.com or your local book store a

1737
01:17:07,790 --> 01:17:05,850
cannabis and spirituality and that is by

1738
01:17:10,370 --> 01:17:07,800
Steven graves been a wonderful guest

1739
01:17:11,900 --> 01:17:10,380
tonight next week we're back to aliens

1740
01:17:14,510 --> 01:17:11,910
and what are they doing they are

1741
01:17:18,290 --> 01:17:14,520
stealing Souls we're going to be talking

1742
01:17:20,480 --> 01:17:18,300
it's someone from the UK who has all the

1743
01:17:23,630 --> 01:17:20,490
scoop on this so until then everybody

1744
01:17:26,250 --> 01:17:23,640
we'll see you on the blue Highway good

1745
01:17:27,620 --> 01:17:26,260
night good night